East Midlands Railway short formed services

[weastebusdepot]

It has been done just not much detail as much detail as you can have now with the diagrams at the bottom. For double sets to London it can display 'A-G front - J-M rear' for example for the orientation of the sets. Local services use to have the number of coaches displayed but I haven't seen that recently.

The displays on platforms 13/14 at Manchester Piccadilly and in the satellite lounge will display EMR services, although it can be contradictory. I've seen it show "formed of 2 coaches" but with a pictogram of four coaches or vice versa, so it's still a mystery until it actually appears.

 

[Dore & Totley]

I have stopped using EMR on the London routes, generally travel via Tamworth on LNW as their trains are pretty much all 8 cars, its much cheaper (c.50%), electric, and the journey is not much longer (under 2 hours Euston to Derby). having a 4 car 222 turn up for a 2 hour plus journey on EMR is not acceptable, and the fares are too high on EMR too. They must be supressing an awful lot of demand...

I echo this. I live in Sheffield but even booking 6 to 8 weeks ahead it's so much cheaper to drive to Doncaster and get the train to King's Cross than book with EMR.

 

[ChrisC]

Hopefully as the goverment starts to level up the north this stop becoming the norm. Finger crossed we will start to see more six to eight car trains in the north like you encounter in and out of London. Sadly it may take some time to get the stock but investment in transport for the regions is at least now a priority.

I’m currently in Exeter having spent 8 days based in Penzance and then Exeter travelling around using a Devon and Cornwall Rover. I know that GWR are not perfect, but what a contrast I have found between local services here and the current situation with EMR when I’m at home.

Most trains I have been on have been at least 4 carriages and nicely refurbished 150’s, 158’s and the HST 4 carriage Castle Class Sets. Not once have I found a train full and standing but there has always been plenty of space. Lines like the Exmouth branch have 2tph and are mostly 4 car. There’s 2tph between Plymouth and Penzance with most trains being 4 or 5 carriages and some as many as 10. Most of the branch lines have at least a train every hour and even the long branch to Barsnsatple has a 3 carriage train every hour. These are just a few examples. Yet we keep hearing that EMR are still not able to even run an hourly service on a route linking the major cities of Liverpool, Manchester, Sheffield, Nottingham and Norwich and even then often with only with 2 carriage trains.

Tomorrow I travel back from Exeter and arrive in Derby at 1136. I have 25 minutes to wait in Derby for a connection to Nottingham as EMR are running reduced timetables. Then when I arrive in Nottingham at 1223 my Robin Hood Line train departs at 1225 so not much chance of that. Again a reduced timetable so another hour to wait in Nottingham. Welcome back to EMR. I’m absolutely fed up of sitting around on Nottingham Station as the current RHL service connects with nothing. The other week I arrived back from Manchester with almost an hour to wait. It’s the same with connections from Norwich. It’s not what people want at the end of a long journey and I don’t think the RHL timetable is going to improve before next May if ever.

 

[SpaldingMan]

Never mind stock issues, I'm in Lincoln tomorrow, and EMR have cancelled 3 of the last 4 southbound trains due to staff shortages (19:12 to Newark, 19:31 to Peterborough and 20:42 to Leicester) leaving just the 19:45 to Newark which already was a replacement bus service

Two significant events going on in Lincoln tomorrow with the National Cycling Championships and football at the
LNER stadium. I know there are hundreds of Charlton fans who have purchased expensive train tickets who will not be happy to be stranded after the game. I was going to go by train tomorrow myself but now that the 17.02 is the last train back to Spalding it will be the car for me.

 

[adrock1976]

Two significant events going on in Lincoln tomorrow with the National Cycling Championships and football at the
LNER stadium. I know there are hundreds of Charlton fans who have purchased expensive train tickets who will not be happy to be stranded after the game. I was going to go by train tomorrow myself but now that the 17.02 is the last train back to Spalding it will be the car for me.

A very quick sideways question:

What and where is the LNER stadium?

Assuming the football side is Lincoln City, I am aware that they play their home matches at Sincil Bank.

 

[cactustwirly]

No doubt the other tactic EMR will employ to curb demand and reduce overcrowding is to ramp up the price of Advance tickets.

Probably cheaper for Sheffield, Chesterfield and Derby passengers to change at Tamworth!

Advance tickets were already quite expensive under Stagecoach

 

[SpaldingMan]

A very quick sideways question:

What and where is the LNER stadium?

Assuming the football side is Lincoln City, I am aware that they play their home matches at Sincil Bank.

Ground at Sincoil Bank was renamed the LNER Stadium presumably in return for sponsorship money to the club.

 

[adrock1976]

Ground at Sincoil Bank was renamed the LNER Stadium presumably in return for sponsorship money to the club.

Many thanks.

 

[Kite159]

I echo this. I live in Sheffield but even booking 6 to 8 weeks ahead it's so much cheaper to drive to Doncaster and get the train to King's Cross than book with EMR.

Although before Covid, it was sometimes cheaper to get a "LNER+ Connections" fare for Sheffield - London (going via Doncaster) or Nottingham - London (via Grantham) than a direct EMR service.

The interior of the 222s are getting a bit tired, with a few seats which has collapsed base cushions.

 

[Mikey C]

Ground at Sincoil Bank was renamed the LNER Stadium presumably in return for sponsorship money to the club.

LNER like football sponsorship, as they've sponsored Doncaster Rovers' shirts for a while!

Two significant events going on in Lincoln tomorrow with the National Cycling Championships and football at the
LNER stadium. I know there are hundreds of Charlton fans who have purchased expensive train tickets who will not be happy to be stranded after the game. I was going to go by train tomorrow myself but now that the 17.02 is the last train back to Spalding it will be the car for me.

Yes, I'm not over impressed.

 

[johnnychips]

The interior of the 222s are getting a bit tired, with a few seats which has collapsed base cushions.

Yes they are, but I would rather have a threadbare 222 than seats in many other trains. The point of this thread is that there aren’t enough of any seats because of shortforms and cancellations.

 

[Foxcover]

1152 EMR Lime St-Nottingham/Norwich showing as 6-car this morning - don’t thing we’ve seen that for a while - perhaps things are looking up!

 

[Killingworth]

IR62 2 car 156 just pased Dore. Looked to be empty?? Northern 3 car services full and standing.

 

[40C]

2L62 Cleethorpes to Leicester, 2 car 170, absolutely rammed this morning. Large number of passengers turned away at Habrough.

 

[dk1]

Just passed through Ely. A delayed Norwich bound EMR service is being delayed even more as seriously overcrowded. Announcements are requesting passengers to wait for the next GA service in ten minutes. This service will no doubt be full leaving Cambridge but room for standees.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Just passed through Ely. A delayed Norwich bound EMR service is being delayed even more as seriously overcrowded. Announcements are requesting passengers to wait for the next GA service in ten minutes. This service will no doubt be full leaving Cambridge but room for standees.

Is this actually a case of 'short forming' (i.e. fewer vehicles than booked)? I thought that EMR services east of Nottingham to Norwich were only booked for two cars since a long time ago.

 

[dk1]

Is this actually a case of 'short forming' (i.e. fewer vehicles than booked)? I thought that EMR services east of Nottingham to Norwich were only booked for two cars since a long time ago.

No booked single unit but not helped by the hit & miss frequency offered at the moment.

 

[WesternLancer]

Meanwhile - what EMR Intercity looks like (allegedly...)

 

[Killingworth]

Meanwhile - what EMR Intercity looks like (allegedly...)

Trades Description Act?

 

[LowLevel]

Additional issues this weekend and over the last couple of days have been caused by no shunter being available at Eastcroft so the depot has been closed during the day.

 

[ScotGG]

What days and times does a 170 get to Norwich and back?

Might take an EMR from Norwich but not sure which departures are 158 and which are 170

 

[dk1]

What days and times does a 170 get to Norwich and back?

Might take an EMR from Norwich but not sure which departures are 158 and which are 170

Think the 170 is something like 11:40 off Nottingham & 14:57 return SX.

 

[ScotGG]

Thanks

 

[STINT47]

The 17:35, 18:35 and 19:35 services from St Pancras to Nottingham have all been reported as being full and standing from St Panvras tonight.

I dont know if any of these services are short formed but it does indicate that EMR are struggling to meet demand and the service is pretty poor.

Sadly the prediction that the new electric trains would free up seats for longer distance passengers, thus allowing the HSTs to go appears to have been made in error.

A real shame. I used to visit London a few times each month by train but wouldn't touch them right now.

 

[Kettledrum]

I have stopped using EMR on the London routes, generally travel via Tamworth on LNW as their trains are pretty much all 8 cars, its much cheaper (c.50%), electric, and the journey is not much longer (under 2 hours Euston to Derby). having a 4 car 222 turn up for a 2 hour plus journey on EMR is not acceptable, and the fares are too high on EMR too. They must be supressing an awful lot of demand...

I echo this. I live in Sheffield but even booking 6 to 8 weeks ahead it's so much cheaper to drive to Doncaster and get the train to King's Cross than book with EMR.

I also stopped using EMR a couple of years ago, and drive to use an alternative train company. I am aware of plenty of others too. The supressed demand is huge. I just got fed up of the short formed services, coupled with the un-competitive train times and prices.

But the hsts aren’t prm compliant

which is worse:

(1) every other train being prm compliant so all passengers, whether disabled or not can get a train and get safely to their destination

or

(2) all services being short and seriously over crowded to the extent that passengers (including disabled and vulnerable people) are left behind on the platform and those that are on board can't make their way to the toilets anyway because the trains are so crowded.

At the moment EMR and the Government have opted for (2). They have hit the target, but completely missed the point.

 

[yorksrob]

The 17:35, 18:35 and 19:35 services from St Pancras to Nottingham have all been reported as being full and standing from St Panvras tonight.

I dont know if any of these services are short formed but it does indicate that EMR are struggling to meet demand and the service is pretty poor.

Sadly the prediction that the new electric trains would free up seats for longer distance passengers, thus allowing the HSTs to go appears to have been made in error.

A real shame. I used to visit London a few times each month by train but wouldn't touch them right now.

For or five carriages rather than eight.

That happened to me, last time I tried to catch an EMR service North.

The yarn that the electric trains would enable the non HST fleet to cope with demand north of Kettering was clearly a confidence trick played on passengers to accept the withdrawal of HST's without adequate stock to replace them.

Lies all lies.

 

[43055]

The 17:35, 18:35 and 19:35 services from St Pancras to Nottingham have all been reported as being full and standing from St Panvras tonight.

I dont know if any of these services are short formed but it does indicate that EMR are struggling to meet demand and the service is pretty poor.

Sadly the prediction that the new electric trains would free up seats for longer distance passengers, thus allowing the HSTs to go appears to have been made in error.

A real shame. I used to visit London a few times each month by train but wouldn't touch them right now.

Sundays have a reduced timetable due to the strike action so only a hourly service on each route instead of half hourly in the afternoon.

 

[Skymonster]

Sundays have a reduced timetable due to the strike action so only a hourly service on each route instead of half hourly in the afternoon.

Yep, another thing that mangers at EMR can’t be bothered to sort out…

 

[XAM2175]

At the moment EMR and the Government have opted for (2). They have hit the target, but completely missed the point.

For correctness I'd note that EMR have very little choice in the matter - it was the Government that chose the deadline and that had the power to issue or not issue the necessary dispensations and exemptions.

 

[Kite159]

And it's a shame they just can't double up the stock (so the hourly trains to Nottingham/Sheffield are 7 or 9/10 coaches) due to the need of having another member of staff in the other unit.