EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

[JaJaWa]

And how far would an early general election help anyone if many candidates in both major parties would be obliged to stand on a platform saying they were going to pursue a policy very much against their own consciences? Do people really think we could get back to a nice bi-partite choice of, say, Labour = we'll stay in (despite the vote in our heartlands) and Tories = we'll get right out? (Or it could be the other way round, of course ....)

Liberal Democrats are saying that a vote for them is a vote to remain in the EU.

 

[muz379]

This is why in my opinion Davis Cameron has been a bit of a d*ck. Article 50 should have been invoked on Friday. If our PM were as patriotic as he likes to make out, he should have swallowed his pride and tried to negotiate the best deal possible for Britain.

But his ego won't allow that. He doesn't want to be remembered as the man who took us out of the EU.

So now we have this period of uncertainty being extended unnecessarily, which is bad for Britain and bad for the EU.

So you want to vote against him and then have him do all the dirty work doing what he clearly did not want to do and had no idea how to do .He would have been unable to do it without being hounded by the leave side at every opportunity . Personally I would have expected his resignation and was always dubious when he said he would trigger art 50 if it was a vote to leave . After all I think David Cameron , the 16 million who voted remain and the 17 million who voted leave would have expected Boris et al to have a plan and have announced their intention by now . Instead we are having to read between the lines in a poorly written self contradicting telegraph column , and interpreting the words of leave campaigners like Daniel Hannan :roll:

 

[Domh245]

It has always been England and Wales together. Wales is so up England's backside that they allow the cricket team to be called "England" even though it represents England and Wales. Could you imagine an England and Scotland team being just called "England", in any sport?

Would that not be founded in the Historical relationship between these countries? England conquered Wales (to become England and Wales) whilst Scotland remained an independent country until joining Union.

 

[radamfi]

Whilst this post (like yours) may be lost amongst the rest of the discussion, I have some good news! On Friday Morning, I received an email from the Vice-Chancellor of the University of Nottingham stressing that nothing is going to change immediately. It also had this quote in it, that might be reassuring to you.

That's good news, but if it was me I would decide to study in another country. I would feel that Britain is no longer welcoming and had basically stuck two fingers up at me.

 

[ainsworth74]

Informal talks were never on the cards. This was made clear by all the other EU member states during Cameron's now voided renegotiation, and during the referendum campaign. It was delusional for anyone to think otherwise.

Oh I know but I thought it might be useful information for those who have been saying that this is the next step.

 

[Bodiddly]

In my heart I am no longer British. I had virtually given up on Britain already but I wish I could burn my UK passport right now and get another nationality straight away.

I find myself now wanting to avoid British goods and deliberately choose EU ones in preference.

My god, are you for real? :roll:

 

[TheKnightWho]

[img="http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m1qgdfiefC1qi6mxw.gif"]http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m1qgdfiefC1qi6mxw.gif[/img]

Is this chap for real or what? :roll:

It was just annoying before the vote. Now it's hilarious because it's so obviously delusional.

 

[YorkshireBear]

So you want to vote against him and then have him do all the dirty work doing what he clearly did not want to do and had no idea how to do .He would have been unable to do it without being hounded by the leave side at every opportunity . Personally I would have expected his resignation and was always dubious when he said he would trigger art 50 if it was a vote to leave . After all I think David Cameron , the 16 million who voted remain and the 17 million who voted leave would have expected Boris et al to have a plan and have announced their intention by now . Instead we are having to read between the lines in a poorly written self contradicting telegraph column , and interpreting the words of leave campaigners like Daniel Hannan :roll:

I expected him to quit. And support him in doing so. The entire campaign the Leave Vote was accused of having no plan but said they did. Time for them to show their cards.

 

[radamfi]

My god, are you for real? :roll:

You don't believe it is possible for the country of your birth to upset you so much that you disown that country?

 

[miami]

That's good news, but if it was me I would decide to study in another country. I would feel that Britain is no longer welcoming and had basically stuck two fingers up at me.

Would that be any different if it had been 52-48 the other way?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I expected him to quit. And support him in doing so. The entire campaign the Leave Vote was accused of having no plan but said they did. Time for them to show their cards.

We know they were lying, we know they have no plan. But forcing them to show us is just political posturing that's harmful to the country.

We need to be getting on with article 50, and negotiating in good faith, sending delegates more like Nick Clegg, not Nigel Farage, to ensure we get the best deal we can in a velvet divorce.

 

[TheKnightWho]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ond-remain-latest-will-we-leave-a7105116.html

More than one million people regret their vote to leave the European Union, an opinion poll carried out in the wake of the Brexit decision suggests.

Of the 17.4 million people who voted Leave, 1.1 million now say they wish they had not, if the results of a Survation poll are to be believed.

The poll found that people who used Brexit as a protest vote - or thought their vote "wouldn't matter" - are now having second thoughts.

One Twitter user posted: "I personally voted Leave because I believed these lies and I regret it more than anything. I feel genuinely robbed of my vote."

The Leave camp polled 1.3 million more votes than Remain in the 23 June referendum.

But about seven per cent of those surveyed by Survation said they regretted ticking "Leave" - a number equal to about 1,130,000.

Yet the poll also showed that thousands of people regretted their vote to remain in the EU, according to the Mail on Sunday.

Despite Leave just winning the referendum, an equivalent of 696,000 people apparently wish they had lent their support to the victorious side.

Had they changed their votes, Remain would not have won but the margin for Brexit would have been narrowed to less than a million.

 

[radamfi]

Would that be any different if it had been 52-48 the other way?

To be honest, I would still be quite disgusted that 48% had decided to vote Leave and I was thinking that in the past few weeks when it looked like Leave was catching up Remain in the polls.

 

[miami]

So you're saying that even after the regrexit votes, we'd still be leaving?

The turkeys have voted for christmas. There's no changing that, we just need to make sure that it's a vegetarian christmas.

 

[TheKnightWho]

So you're saying that even after the regrexit votes, we'd still be leaving?

The turkeys have voted for christmas. There's no changing that, we just need to make sure that it's a vegetarian christmas.

After 2 days of trading. The pound is now on $1.32, which is (a tiny bit) worse than it ever was as the vote was happening and in the immediate aftermath.

I fully expect the number of Bregrexiters to soar.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You don't believe it is possible for the country of your birth to upset you so much that you disown that country?

I wouldn't go quite that far, but I certainly have similar leanings given the amount of racist filth that has been being spewed.

 

[WestCoast]

You don't believe it is possible for the country of your birth to upset you so much that you disown that country?

The important thing now is to campaign for full EEA membership, if that's what you want (I do). It won't please certain sections of the Leave vote, but they were sold a lie in my view anyway.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

You don't believe it is possible for the country of your birth to upset you so much that you disown that country?

Kim Philby, George Blake, Guy Burgess and Donald MacLean are four names immediately springing to my mind.

 

[crehld]

I wouldn't go quite that far, but I certainly have similar leanings given the amount of racist filth that has been being spewed.

As do I.

 

[YorkshireBear]

We know they were lying, we know they have no plan. But forcing them to show us is just political posturing that's harmful to the country.

We need to be getting on with article 50, and negotiating in good faith, sending delegates more like Nick Clegg, not Nigel Farage, to ensure we get the best deal we can in a velvet divorce.

I am not necessarily saying that is what i think should have happened. But that is what is going to happen now. No one from the remain side is going to be PM.... I think we can be pretty certain of that. So its going to be someone from the leave side negotiating. Fairly confident it will be Boris. So the plan will have to come out.

Another potential risk is the longer we wait the more belligerent some EU countries might become in negotiations. Our uncertainty is economically affecting them too.

Like you say, we need to get on with article 50, they wanted to leave so I don't understand why it has to wait so long. Uncertainty will only make the impacts worse.

 

[TheKnightWho]

It's very telling that Remain voters all seem to be on the same page, despite often disagreeing about specifics under ordinary circumstances.

 

[radamfi]

The important thing now is to campaign for full EEA membership, if that's what you want (I do).

Oh yes, I do want that. It looks like it is the most likely outcome, but we have learned not to take anything for granted.

 

[Harbornite]

Beggars belief really. Was it that hard for people to do their own research before voting? I don't want to sound snobby but this boils down to a lack of education, intelligence and common sense.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Beggars belief really. Was it that hard for people to do their own research before voting? I don't want to sound snobby but this boils down to a lack of education, intelligence and common sense.

I originally believed that.

However on reflection. We know that, we know people are not going to educate themselves when politicians give them reasons. UKIP was big on campaigning with lots of facts, latching onto fears etc. And nobody did anything to combat them. You can't say that the voted because of a lack of intelligence, they were never given the intelligence by the remain campaign who were drab at best. Especially Labour who had an opportunity. I would not be surprised to see that Corbyn acted purposefully to not provide any meaningful support to remain. At the end of the day Vote Leave campaigned harder and provided passion, even if it was lies.

 

[DaleCooper]

Beggars belief really. Was it that hard for people to do their own research before voting? I don't want to sound snobby but this boils down to a lack of education, intelligence and common sense.

Don't forget that ~50% of people are below average on all of those measurements

 

[Domh245]

Don't forget that ~50% of people are below average on all of those measurements

One of the other quotes that I'm seeing a lot of at the moment (the other being Winston Churchill democracy quote)

“Think of how stupid the average person is, and realise half of them are stupider than that.”

 

[northwichcat]

I originally believed that.

However on reflection. We know that, we know people are not going to educate themselves when politicians give them reasons. UKIP was big on campaigning with lots of facts, latching onto fears etc. And nobody did anything to combat them. You can't say that the voted because of a lack of intelligence, they were never given the intelligence by the remain campaign who were drab at best. Especially Labour who had an opportunity. I would not be surprised to see that Corbyn acted purposefully to not provide any meaningful support to remain. At the end of the day Vote Leave campaigned harder and provided passion, even if it was lies.

I got that impression at the last general election. The impartial experts all said the Conservative's and Labour's financial plans were incomplete meaning there was something they weren't telling us meaning the Lib Dems were the only party was a credible financial plan. Yet Cameron and Osborne banged on about being the Conservatives being only party with a credible financial plan and Clegg struggled to come up with reasons why he didn't block the Conservative's tuition fee rises which resulted in the Conservatives winning and then a lot of public shock when Osborne announced further spending cuts which weren't in the Conservative manifesto.

 

[jon0844]

This is why in my opinion Davis Cameron has been a bit of a d*ck. Article 50 should have been invoked on Friday. If our PM were as patriotic as he likes to make out, he should have swallowed his pride and tried to negotiate the best deal possible for Britain.

But his ego won't allow that. He doesn't want to be remembered as the man who took us out of the EU.

So now we have this period of uncertainty being extended unnecessarily, which is bad for Britain and bad for the EU.

He was for remain. How could you want him to negotiate? He would be trying to get a deal you wouldn't like, that is as close to remaining as possible.

He did the honourable thing and resigned and now the leave side must take responsibility for their actions.

You mentioned immigration, so surely you expect negotiations to be on outright leaving and no trade agreements - otherwise why would we have had the referendum? Both choices would have been remain.

 

[ExRes]

I wouldn't go quite that far, but I certainly have similar leanings given the amount of racist filth that has been being spewed.

But lets be fair about this, racist filth has been spewed in this country, and most others, all others?, since people first discovered their skin or their language was different from another, it is totally unfair to paint everyone in the same manner as the morons who are showing their finely honed sense of stupidity at this moment, give them a week or two and they'll be back to hunting a mammoth for dinner

 

[VauxhallandI]

You don't believe it is possible for the country of your birth to upset you so much that you disown that country?

I'm on holiday in Spain at the moment (yes I know my mini budget has just been blown) and the other night is the last time I will let a waiter mistake me for being English!

 

[jon0844]

It's very telling that Remain voters all seem to be on the same page, despite often disagreeing about specifics under ordinary circumstances.

Probably because all of our problems were not, to the best of my knowledge, anything to do with the EU.