Group Bourdon Tool

[Beveridges]

It really is better to be on the safe side with Group Boredon as OPC/CCL are failing more & more results that you would expect to pass (see above).
You should nowadays be aiming for a speed of above 1400 and less than 5 omissions or mistakes. Obviously this is impossible without a lot of practice.

 

[Waikikibaby]

I've heard that if there are too many applicants then the tests get harder.

Suppose you're on an assessment day with 40 candidates, 30 get through by lunchtime and normally there'd only be about half the original amount, after another test or two there are still 25 people hanging in there.......that's when they might pull out the harder tests. Get those 25 people down to the expected 5 or 6.

Just something that I've heard from one person who may or may not be a reliable source.

 

[ultra4]

I disagree.
Me thinks: There must be a set pass mark in order for the test to be accurate and fair.
i.e. you may have 40 candidates, perfect for the job, doing exceptionally well at GBT.
They are all potential drivers. Why to loose 20 of them?
i.e.2 you have 40 useless candidates, all doing poorly at GBT.
Would 20 of them been put through?
nah...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

It really is better to be on the safe side with Group Boredon as OPC/CCL are failing more & more results that you would expect to pass (see above).
You should nowadays be aiming for a speed of above 1400 and less than 5 omissions or mistakes. Obviously this is impossible without a lot of practice.

Group-Bourdon Result Statistics
Saved on 10/16/2013 at 9:14:24 PM
-------------------------------



Overall Statistics:
-------------------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ 4
Marked Incorrect ----------- 2


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 1951
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.191
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.150

Completed Rows ------------- 76
Mean Row Time -------------- 4.760
Median Row Time ------------ 4.740


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 2.07



---------------------------------------------

My assessment is 2morrow.
Still practicing, although GBT is a drop in the ocean with this new assessment regime.
TEA, scares me a bit, and TRP 1

 

[TDK]

It really is better to be on the safe side with Group Boredon as OPC/CCL are failing more & more results that you would expect to pass (see above).
You should nowadays be aiming for a speed of above 1400 and less than 5 omissions or mistakes. Obviously this is impossible without a lot of practice.

And your source on these figures Bev.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I've heard that if there are too many applicants then the tests get harder.

Suppose you're on an assessment day with 40 candidates, 30 get through by lunchtime and normally there'd only be about half the original amount, after another test or two there are still 25 people hanging in there.......that's when they might pull out the harder tests. Get those 25 people down to the expected 5 or 6.

Just something that I've heard from one person who may or may not be a reliable source.

The tests remain the same, the pass rate remains the same except companies will not take borderline passes and more will fail at interview
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I disagree.
Me thinks: There must be a set pass mark in order for the test to be accurate and fair.
i.e. you may have 40 candidates, perfect for the job, doing exceptionally well at GBT.
They are all potential drivers. Why to loose 20 of them?
i.e.2 you have 40 useless candidates, all doing poorly at GBT.
Would 20 of them been put through?
nah...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Group-Bourdon Result Statistics
Saved on 10/16/2013 at 9:14:24 PM
-------------------------------



Overall Statistics:
-------------------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ 4
Marked Incorrect ----------- 2


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 1951
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.191
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.150

Completed Rows ------------- 76
Mean Row Time -------------- 4.760
Median Row Time ------------ 4.740


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 2.07



---------------------------------------------

My assessment is 2morrow.
Still practicing, although GBT is a drop in the ocean with this new assessment regime.
TEA, scares me a bit, and TRP 1

Those figures will not be as good as 1200 with no errors or omissions but all you new prospective train drivers keep trying to hit the 2000 mark as this will enable all those with 1200 a better chance of success.

 

[ultra4]

Which one of you guys found paper GBT to be easier than computerized version?
Is it possible to attach a survey to the post in this forum?
If not we can simply post answers.
Me first:

PAPER VERSION

 

[mickeyjenson!]

Anyone know if you get penalised for not completing lines on the real test, say for instance they say change and your half through the line will that cost you ?

 

[TDK]

Anyone know if you get penalised for not completing lines on the real test, say for instance they say change and your half through the line will that cost you ?

No it wont cost you

 

[youngboy]

I did the paper version earlier this year and got a pass, which is now considered a borderline pass. I completed 10,8.5,10,10,10, pretty sure I got through all correct but only got a borderline pass. This was however the one and only time I've ever completed the test and never practised it beforehand. Pretty convinced that page 2 let me down for a good pass, I got lost on the page for a split second and that error lost me 1.5 lines. So IMO take your time aim for ten lines all correct and I think that would get you through. Don't go for speed and 15 lines a page it isn't necessary !!!

 

[TDK]

I did the paper version earlier this year and got a pass, which is now considered a borderline pass. I completed 10,8.5,10,10,10, pretty sure I got through all correct but only got a borderline pass. This was however the one and only time I've ever completed the test and never practised it beforehand. Pretty convinced that page 2 let me down for a good pass, I got lost on the page for a split second and that error lost me 1.5 lines. So IMO take your time aim for ten lines all correct and I think that would get you through. Don't go for speed and 15 lines a page it isn't necessary !!!

If you had 6 or 7 lines all correct it would have been a good pass

 

[ash39]

Just started practicing group bordon again. I first tried it a couple of years ago and can't remember my stats now, but I'm pretty happy with these. My assessment is next Tuesday so I still have time to practice, but I think I'll prioritise the other tests as this would probably be a pass from what I've read here.

Targets Omitted ------------ 1
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 1271
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.306
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.270

Completed Rows ------------- 48
Mean Row Time -------------- 7.655
Median Row Time ------------ 7.650


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 3.94
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Just to show practice definitely makes for improvement. If you've got onto an assessment day you'd be daft not to use the tool...


Overall Statistics:
-------------------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 1395
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.279
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.250

Completed Rows ------------- 54
Mean Row Time -------------- 6.962
Median Row Time ------------ 6.850


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 3.12

 

[DunfordBridge]

I had a spare ten minutes this morning so I thought I would try doing a Group Bourdon test for the first time in weeks. I completed 58 rows with 2 omissions. I was not actually performing much better when I practised regularly maybe completing 61 or 62 rows on occasion, disregarding the motivation aspect as I do not have any applications on the go at the moment.

It might be just me but it makes me wonder if there is any point in practising to excess, not that I ever went to town on this test even though I have wasted endless hours on this test because my pass from the conductor assessment was quite adequate apparently.

I would recommend losing your virginity with this test, so to speak, just to get used to the pseudo-random dottiness of the boredom test.

 

[Theukslayer]

Hi ash39, have you heard anything back from northern with regards to your assessment on Tuesday ?

 

[gazcat]

hello, just wondering if anyone could clarify something in relation to the paper based group bourdon test in an assessment centre?
do you need to count the amount of strikes or boxes you mark, and remember that so as to fill in a total completed box anywhere?
or is it a case of striking through as many as you can as accurately as you can, leaving the assessor to count them?

 

[Waikikibaby]

hello, just wondering if anyone could clarify something in relation to the paper based group bourdon test in an assessment centre?
do you need to count the amount of strikes or boxes you mark, and remember that so as to fill in a total completed box anywhere?
or is it a case of striking through as many as you can as accurately as you can, leaving the assessor to count them?

You just need to strike through the shapes from left to right and line to line. Do as many as you can in the time, they'll do all the counting up afterwards.

 

[gazcat]

You just need to strike through the shapes from left to right and line to line. Do as many as you can in the time, they'll do all the counting up afterwards.

Thanks for your answer Waikikibaby

 

[TDK]

I see many people on here boasting about how good they are at GB and what speed they are getting to but none of them hardly ever come back saying they have passed the tests, strange that!

 

[DunfordBridge]

Passed the GB test over a year ago and passed all other driver tests a few months ago apart from the CBI. I always preferred the DTG test. Funny how there is no equivalent test in the new driver assessments for foot co-ordination.

 

[Beveridges]

I see many people on here boasting about how good they are at GB and what speed they are getting to but none of them hardly ever come back saying they have passed the tests, strange that!

GBT is a little 10 minute test out of a full day assessment.

 

[TDK]

GBT is a little 10 minute test out of a full day assessment.

This thread is for the GBT and it is this thread I am referring to and this thread where members of the forum look for help with the GBT.

 

[NI 271]

I see many people on here boasting about how good they are at GB and what speed they are getting to but none of them hardly ever come back saying they have passed the tests, strange that!

Maybe that's because...

This thread is for the GBT and it is this thread I am referring to and this thread where members of the forum look for help with the GBT.

...?

 

[beavercreek]

I did exactly 10 lines per page which works out at 1250 cells.I got a good pass and got the job as trainee driver.

 

[Beveridges]

I did 13 lines per page which is around 1600 cells. I got an outstanding pass back in 2008. My only regret was wasting so much time over practising the Group Boredom tool. Once I had hit 10 lines per page I should have stopped practising as everything after that was just wasting my time.

 

[TDK]

I did 13 lines per page which is around 1600 cells. I got an outstanding pass back in 2008. My only regret was wasting so much time over practising the Group Boredom tool. Once I had hit 10 lines per page I should have stopped practising as everything after that was just wasting my time.

I cannot remember how many lines I did and had no practice back in 1999 however I looked at the sheet and deducted all the groups of four were either square, diamond or a "Y" shape and looked for the shapes, I completed constantly over half a page on each sheet with out any omissions or mistakes as I did not get bogged down counting the dots but looking for shapes instead. I do not know whether the format of the dots has changed and the shapes are now different but that is what I would say using your initiative.

 

[hidden]

I have my assessment later this week with Northern for a trainee conductor role.

I have been practicing the SCAAT test and obtained the following result

(3 pages @ 1 min each)

SCAAT Result Statistics
Saved on 31/12/2013 at 15:20:18
-------------------------------



Overall Statistics:
-------------------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ 11
Marked Incorrect ----------- 1


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 512
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.225
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.140

Completed Rows ------------- 19
Mean Row Time -------------- 5.544
Median Row Time ------------ 5.100


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 4.88



---------------------------------------------

What do we reckon? I'm going to keep practising, this was the first time I did it on the computer ^.

 

[ewsdbs]

Hello again guys. I gave the test another go, after passing 20+ years ago. Here's how I got on. Don't know if it's good or bad:

-------------------------------



Overall Statistics:
-------------------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 1020
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.380
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.320

Completed Rows ------------- 38
Mean Row Time -------------- 9.462
Median Row Time ------------ 9.515


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 4.73



---------------------------------------------



Individual Sheet Statistics:
----------------------------


Sheet: 1
--------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 182
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.426

Completed Rows ------------- 7
Mean Row Time -------------- 10.670

Fastest Row ---------------- 9.32
Slowest Row ---------------- 12.43


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 3.11


---------------------------------------------


Sheet: 2
--------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 210
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.369

Completed Rows ------------- 8
Mean Row Time -------------- 9.253

Fastest Row ---------------- 7.82
Slowest Row ---------------- 11.32


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 3.50


---------------------------------------------


Sheet: 3
--------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 219
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.354

Completed Rows ------------- 8
Mean Row Time -------------- 8.814

Fastest Row ---------------- 7.83
Slowest Row ---------------- 11.59


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 3.76


---------------------------------------------


Sheet: 4
--------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 213
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.363

Completed Rows ------------- 8
Mean Row Time -------------- 9.120

Fastest Row ---------------- 7.70
Slowest Row ---------------- 9.73


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 2.03


---------------------------------------------


Sheet: 5
--------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 196
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.395

Completed Rows ------------- 7
Mean Row Time -------------- 9.623

Fastest Row ---------------- 8.70
Slowest Row ---------------- 10.23


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 1.53


---------------------------------------------

 

[DunfordBridge]

I did not know the test was so mature.

 

[Septus]

Well I must have passed my GB test, seen as I passed my stage 1 with FGW.

Although I have no idea how I did. I only know that on sheet no2 I marked one wrong and ended up been a line or too short on that sheet compared to others as it threw my concentration slightly.

Oh and it seemed a hell of a lot easier to do on paper than on the computer!

 

[benno79]

I think the GB test was introduced in 88, I may be wrong though.

 

[DunfordBridge]

I was not even old enough to apply for a conductor's job in 1988, let alone a driver's job.

Today I thought it would be an idea to practise the test again as I have failed to do so since the last time I posted on this thread. Got two times 57 rows with three and two omissions respectively. It was a bit frustrating as I was that close to getting 13 rows on two of the sheets if I could have bothered pushing myself a bit more on this boring test.

Bearing in mind that the new Vigilance test from Schuhfried is half a hour long, supposing if anyone had devised a practising tool, it would be a good test of time-management skills to find the opportunity to practise for this test.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I cannot remember how many lines I did and had no practice back in 1999 however I looked at the sheet and deducted all the groups of four were either square, diamond or a "Y" shape and looked for the shapes, I completed constantly over half a page on each sheet with out any omissions or mistakes as I did not get bogged down counting the dots but looking for shapes instead. I do not know whether the format of the dots has changed and the shapes are now different but that is what I would say using your initiative.

In addition to the advice from TDK, I would like to add that it is good when you can a long run of threes but not so good when you get a long run of fives as you need to be careful about what is seemingly interspersed amongst the fives, for example a four.

 

[youngboy]

I was not even old enough to apply for a conductor's job in 1988, let alone a driver's job.

Today I thought it would be an idea to practise the test again as I have failed to do so since the last time I posted on this thread. Got two times 57 rows with three and two omissions respectively. It was a bit frustrating as I was that close to getting 13 rows on two of the sheets if I could have bothered pushing myself a bit more on this boring test.

Bearing in mind that the new Vigilance test from Schuhfried is half a hour long, supposing if anyone had devised a practising tool, it would be a good test of time-management skills to find the opportunity to practise for this test.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


In addition to the advice from TDK, I would like to add that it is good when you can a long run of threes but not so good when you get a long run of fives as you need to be careful about what is seemingly interspersed amongst the fives, for example a four.

Did this test a few weeks ago and passed, I did nine lines on each page !!

The assessor from the OPC stated at least half a dozen times, go as quickly as you can but remember ....accuracy is the key !!