I admit it. I like Pacers.

[4SRKT]

Let's face it, where else can you see Leyland Nationals in regular service these days except on the railways! Also, where can you actually ride on what are still referred to as 'bus-type' seats on a bus these days, except on some 142s?

 

[Lampshade]

Loads of places, Preston Bus has Tridents with those seats, Stagecoach in Manchester has some Darts like that...

Tonight I caught 142026 from Piccadilly to Bolton, the ex-ATN seats are fantastic.

 

[Drsatan]

Building a new design of Railbus would probably just be repeating all the mistakes caused when the Pacers were introduced by short-sighted ordering of trains that would be obsolete in terms of passenger comfort inside 20 years, just like the buses they are based on, except that the buses were only expected to have an operational life of 15 years, whereas the trains are expected to last at least twice that.

To replace the Pacers, 150s, and 153s, I think a tried-and-tested design (such as the Bombardier Talent, or Stadler FLIRT) should be ordered with adaptations for use in Britain.

 

[4SRKT]

Loads of places, Preston Bus has Tridents with those seats, Stagecoach in Manchester has some Darts like that...

Tonight I caught 142026 from Piccadilly to Bolton, the ex-ATN seats are fantastic.

Looks like the North West is home to all the bus seats then, whether on trains or buses! Pretty much all the buses round here have better seats now, except the few remaining Alexander bodied Volvos that are mainly confined to school services.

 

[387star]

The class 150s and especially 153s have loads of life left in them whilst the 142s are a bit of a national disgrace when they are used on SOME services, but adapt well when used on others.

Interestingly the 143s and 144s have aged a lot better- they look a lot more modern

 

[Failed Unit]

The class 150s and especially 153s have loads of life left in them whilst the 142s are a bit of a national disgrace when they are used on SOME services, but adapt well when used on others.

Interestingly the 143s and 144s have aged a lot better- they look a lot more modern

The recent article about the 153s said some of them have body sag on them, don't know if that is a major problem or not. But I think the pacer will probably be easier to make ready for the DDA then the 153. Although the solution there may be to remove the toilet and couple to a 156 permanently.

 

[Lampshade]

Interestingly the 143s and 144s have aged a lot better- they look a lot more modern

Livery makes quite a difference, Northern livery makes anything it's applied to look at least 10 years older, look at the 142s and 150s, they were nice in NWT gold star livery but look nasty in Northern purple/lilac/mauve/whatever it is.

FGW's local lines livery on the 143s works really well.

The recent article about the 153s said some of them have body sag on them, don't know if that is a major problem or not. But I think the pacer will probably be easier to make ready for the DDA then the 153. Although the solution there may be to remove the toilet and couple to a 156 permanently.

The 155s have this problem as well (hardly a surprise).

 

[142094]

Looks like the North West is home to all the bus seats then, whether on trains or buses! Pretty much all the buses round here have better seats now, except the few remaining Alexander bodied Volvos that are mainly confined to school services.

There was a 142 doing the Selby -Wakefield Westgate and also a Bradford - Leeds run last week that had bus seats. Not too often seen over this side of the Pennines. Suprised to see one at Darlo earlier on in the year as well - although I was on it for abot 20 seconds (got cancelled so bailed).

 

[4SRKT]

There was a 142 doing the Selby -Wakefield Westgate and also a Bradford - Leeds run last week that had bus seats. Not too often seen over this side of the Pennines. Suprised to see one at Darlo earlier on in the year as well - although I was on it for abot 20 seconds (got cancelled so bailed).

Frankly bus seats are needed for the full nostalgia experience. I've got a photo taken at York in 1985 or 1986 at the long gone platform 5 (where the car park by platform 2 is now) of a 142, 144 and 150/2 when they were all brand new. I've also got a lovely one of a 143 in T&W livery at Newcastle on a gorgeous summer's day when new. I'll have to scan and upload them. The units were in York station to show the 'lucky' punters what the future was to hold. I'm sure people liked the look of the 150, but possibly less so when they found out that one of their first uses would be to displace loco haulage on the North Trans-Pennine. Hull to Holyhead on a 150 anyone? No thanks. I did it once from Huddersfield to Holyhead for the 03:15 boat to Dun Laoghaire. It was every bit as bad as you might expect, and it was the first time ever I'd wished a peak was on the front of my train!

 

[Darandio]

There was a 142 doing the Selby -Wakefield Westgate and also a Bradford - Leeds run last week that had bus seats. Not too often seen over this side of the Pennines. Suprised to see one at Darlo earlier on in the year as well - although I was on it for abot 20 seconds (got cancelled so bailed).

Crops up quite often that one to be honest, I have had it many times from Redcar to Darlington. Originally, the only up side was that it looked "clean" but that has now gone from the plus points. Was it the only one done? Or at least the only one to be allocated over this side?

Actually, I meant to say something about this ages ago. Other units have the heating vent alongside the full length of the train, gives you nice warm legs in the winter. However, this unit has them removed with the floor merging with the wall. The only source of heat I could find was by being near the moulded handles near the doors. Is this right?

 

[4SRKT]

Right, sometime in the near future I'm going to do a Day Rover that consists of nothing but pacers. Going to be a bit restrictive (especially as I'll have to start and end at Shipley, so will have to get the 16:39 Morecambe home or stay in Leeds), but should be a challenge!

In my mileage spreadsheet log I have a main count but also separate counts ((((=SUMIF)))) for various categories of 'interesting' traction, namely loco-hauled, HST, steam, DEMU (the NIR kind, not Voyagers) and pacers. How many people would have the pacer category I wonder.

 

[142094]

Actually, I meant to say something about this ages ago. Other units have the heating vent alongside the full length of the train, gives you nice warm legs in the winter. However, this unit has them removed with the floor merging with the wall. The only source of heat I could find was by being near the moulded handles near the doors. Is this right?

The overhead heating was the original IIRC. I'm not sure if that unit was actually allocated to Heaton that I saw at Darlo (it was 070, just found a pic of it), but what I thought must have happened was that it was up at Heaton from Newton Heath for maintenance or something and got put on the rota.

Right, sometime in the near future I'm going to do a Day Rover that consists of nothing but pacers. Going to be a bit restrictive (especially as I'll have to start and end at Shipley, so will have to get the 16:39 Morecambe home or stay in Leeds), but should be a challenge!

In my mileage spreadsheet log I have a main count but also separate counts ((((=SUMIF)))) for various categories of 'interesting' traction, namely loco-hauled, HST, steam, DEMU (the NIR kind, not Voyagers) and pacers. How many people would have the pacer category I wonder.

Give me a shout when you're doing this and if you don't mind I'll come along. Will mean I'll have to go via Harrogate to get to Leeds...

I haven't actually worked out my mileages ever, but probably will start doing so. More than likely I bet Pacers will be no 1.

 

[4SRKT]

The overhead heating was the original IIRC. I'm not sure if that unit was actually allocated to Heaton that I saw at Darlo (it was 070, just found a pic of it), but what I thought must have happened was that it was up at Heaton from Newton Heath for maintenance or something and got put on the rota.



Give me a shout when you're doing this and if you don't mind I'll come along. Will mean I'll have to go via Harrogate to get to Leeds...

I haven't actually worked out my mileages ever, but probably will start doing so. More than likely I bet Pacers will be no 1.

Are there still pacer diagrams on the Harrogate line?

What are the routes within WY? Leeds/Wakefield > Knottingley; Leeds > Darton; Leeds > Huddersfield/Todmorden (via Brighouse); Huddersfield > Denby Dale, Leeds/Pontefract Baghill > Moorthorpe, Leeds > Keighley (Morecambe trains only including the 16:39 which also stops at Steeton). If the rule is all pacer lines have to be covered and no non-pacers are allowed, getting back from Steeton could be interesting......

 

[142094]

A couple are 144s, occasionally a 142 in the morning. There used to be a good website with the workings on but don't think it has been updated in a few years.

 

[4SRKT]

A couple are 144s, occasionally a 142 in the morning. There used to be a good website with the workings on but don't think it has been updated in a few years.

And what about getting back? Are there still pacers Selby > York? Is that even a valid route from Leeds?

 

[142094]

And what about getting back? Are there still pacers Selby > York? Is that even a valid route from Leeds?

There used to be one Selby - York in the morning, but not anymore. Still depends on what Rover it is, could get lucky and get a Leeds - Selby train as far as Micklefield on a 142 with the WY Day Rover.

 

[Failed Unit]

And what about getting back? Are there still pacers Selby > York? Is that even a valid route from Leeds?

A lot of 158s on this route heading to Hull when I am going through York, but I don't know for sure if this route doesn't still see a pacer.

 

[ainsworth74]

A lot of 158s on this route heading to Hull when I am going through York

I've never seen anything other than 158s running the service around Hull (well apart from one time when there was a 150, but that was still coupled to a 158!). I have seen 142s parked up in the south facing bay (platform 1?) at York that normally hosts trains to Selby/Hull recently, but I don't know where they were heading.

 

[142094]

I've never seen anything other than 158s running the service around Hull (well apart from one time when there was a 150, but that was still coupled to a 158!). I have seen 142s parked up in the south facing bay (platform 1?) at York that normally hosts trains to Selby/Hull recently, but I don't know where they were heading.

It might have changed but sometimes ones comes from Selby early morning, then leaves ECS to somewhere. There are still a few of the Selby - Leeds - Huddersfield - Wakefield trains that are 142/4s.

 

[YorkshireBear]

I've never seen anything other than 158s running the service around Hull (well apart from one time when there was a 150, but that was still coupled to a 158!). I have seen 142s parked up in the south facing bay (platform 1?) at York that normally hosts trains to Selby/Hull recently, but I don't know where they were heading.

Maybe it was sheffield train

 

[bradders1983]

Maybe it was sheffield train

Probably was. Only 3/4 trains a day to Sheffield from York via Pontefract.

 

[142094]

There is only two in each direction. I haven't seen the Sheffield train use platform 1 in a while, normally 6 or 7.

 

[YorkshireBear]

There is only two in each direction. I haven't seen the Sheffield train use platform 1 in a while, normally 6 or 7.

Yeah i thought they used 6/7 but it was just a maybe as that service i have onyl seen two other things on it.
The SW trains 158 that northern loaned because it was stuck in sheffield because line to doncaster closed due to chavs
or occasinally a 153

 

[driver9000]

Do you mean ex-ATN; Northern as opposed to Wales? Although to be fair, some of the 142s currently with Northern were transferred over from Valley Lines in 2002 in exchange for a similar number of RRNE 142s in better condition.

The 142s sent to Wales from the North East were in exchange for the 150/2s in the 27x range which carried RR colours until repainted into Northern livery. The only 'Welsh' 142 to be sent was 142069 which worked for FNW for a short time in 2004.

 

[sprinterguy]

The 142s sent to Wales from the North East were in exchange for the 150/2s in the 27x range which carried RR colours until repainted into Northern livery. The only 'Welsh' 142 to be sent was 142069 which worked for FNW for a short time in 2004.

That was an earlier swap, I'm not quite sure when but I think it was in around 1998. The Valley Lines/ATN Pacer swap took place in 2002, when 142072-082 (except 142078/9) went from the North East to Wales, and 142086-94 (which must be the units that went to Wales in exchange for the 150/2s) travelled in the opposite direction to the north east.

 

[4SRKT]

Bl**dy rivet counters

 

[sprinterguy]

Bl**dy rivet counters

And there's plenty of rivets to be counted on a Pacer, for anyone who's ever read the Hornby blurb beneath the Pacer models in the catalogues

The Pacers that arrived in the north east in '02 definitely appeared Welsh enough with their Valley Lines branding (and being decidedly more knackered) despite only having been away for four, maybe five, years from their native north of England.

 

[Lampshade]

I went from Salford Crescent to Preston on an ex-Merseytravel 142 today, quite possibly the worst journey by train I've ever had, noisy, jerky, draughty, cold and generally depressing

 

[EWS 58038]

I will only start to like the Pacer when it's retired and runs up and down the 18 mile long Great Central Railway from Leicester to Nottingham. (yes I do have a crystal ball)

 

[sprinterguy]

I went from Salford Crescent to Preston on an ex-Merseytravel 142 today, quite possibly the worst journey by train I've ever had, noisy, jerky, draughty, cold and generally depressing

Surely the trains can't be blamed for the general condition of the north west