Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[stevenedin]

Bustimes has messed up the electrics are now showing in the wrong order and are appearing at the end now. Not sure what’s going on.

 

[Bus9120UK]

Bustimes has messed up the electrics are now showing in the wrong order and are appearing at the end now. Not sure what’s going on.

Its a weird thing with bustimes - after a day or two any buses with the fleet number changed from the locator one (such as TB1 changed from 167 or 701e changed from 701) appear at the bottom of the list. You also can't use the next/previous buttons on the individual pages for these buses.

427 departed for paint yesterday - it looks like now they are at Longstone they are able to take one off at a time for repaint. This does confirm this batch won't be cascaded to Lothian Country or East Coast Buses. Of course when they were at Central it was the Enviro 400 XLBs being prioritized.

 

[NorthClyde320]

Its a weird thing with bustimes - after a day or two any buses with the fleet number changed from the locator one (such as TB1 changed from 167 or 701e changed from 701) appear at the bottom of the list. You also can't use the next/previous buttons on the individual pages for these buses.

427 departed for paint yesterday - it looks like now they are at Longstone they are able to take one off at a time for repaint. This does confirm this batch won't be cascaded to Lothian Country or East Coast Buses. Of course when they were at Central it was the Enviro 400 XLBs being prioritized.

Could 551-570 be potential candidates for transfer to Lothian Country once all the BZL's are in service? Would keep all the B5LH batch together in one place.

 

[overthewater]

551-570 be potential candidates for transfer to Lothian Country once all the BZL's are in service? Would keep all the B5LH batch together in one place.

Would that replace the existing stock or could that help make a start to try and make improvements to West Lothian network?

 

[LothianLover88]

Noticed on the BZLs recently that they only have 4 seats at the back instead of the 5 like on the rest of the fleet & 700e (besides the 7900s). What is the point of this?

 

[VioletEclipse]

Noticed on the BZLs recently that they only have 4 seats at the back instead of the 5 like on the rest of the fleet & 700e (besides the 7900s). What is the point of this?

I'm not sure on the official reason, but it does make the back bench a bit less unfomfortable in comparison to the other seats. I'm probably not the only person who will only be the 5th person on the back bench on busy services when there are no other seats available upstairs, and a seat on the back bench of a BZL would likely seem a bit more inviting when it's the only free seat compared to a bus with a regular back bench.

 

[buslad1988]

Noticed on the BZLs recently that they only have 4 seats at the back instead of the 5 like on the rest of the fleet & 700e (besides the 7900s). What is the point of this?

I think you’ll find that’s standard now on the majority of new double deckers; certainly in London and those operators in the provinces that tend to specify/afford higher spec’d vehicles. I think its original purpose was to eradicate the middle seat directly facing the gangway where you could be potentially propelled down if the driver had to brake heavily.

It certainly makes the rear seats more inviting, less awkward if you’re squashed in with strangers and also takes away some of the anti social behaviour from youths congregating at the back.

 

[Highland050261]

Its a weird thing with bustimes - after a day or two any buses with the fleet number changed from the locator one (such as TB1 changed from 167 or 701e changed from 701) appear at the bottom of the list. You also can't use the next/previous buttons on the individual pages for these buses.

427 departed for paint yesterday - it looks like now they are at Longstone they are able to take one off at a time for repaint. This does confirm this batch won't be cascaded to Lothian Country or East Coast Buses. Of course when they were at Central it was the Enviro 400 XLBs being prioritized.

There is a fault with bustimes.org at the moment, where a part of the site was changed, affecting all lists with letters in them, such as Metroline, McGill's, and the Lothian 700 series.

 

[NorthClyde320]

Would that replace the existing stock or could that help make a start to try and make improvements to West Lothian network?

Replace the 7 09 plates which can be sold, put the MXZ batch into reserve incase of future improvements if or when that might be.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

711 now out as of this morning.

 

[percycranky]

Excellent! Another BZL in service. Has anyone been on 711e yet to see if there are any changes to announcements/stop graphics etc.? It's on the 8 at the moment.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Excellent! Another BZL in service. Has anyone been on 711e yet to see if there are any changes to announcements/stop graphics etc.? It's on the 8 at the moment.

I’m on it just now. It’s exactly the same as the others, no difference whatsoever. Just obviously looks and smells newer and has only done 1,000 miles compared to the others which are on about 3,000 now.

 

[Lx008]

Can someone explain the point of the extra services of the 9 if they refuse to stop when there are still people waiting at the stops?

Was a attempting to get on a nine this morning headed to Kings buildings and the first (BZL run) service was full, the first extra only could get 5 people on and that left around 20 people left at the stop, however the second extra, upon seeing the first extra still there, simply drove past even though it was nearly empty.

Lothian really need to work on either improving communication or reminding the drivers that the 9 is very very full in the morning and even though there are two buses ahead of them, there may still be people waiting at the stop

 

[CN04NRJ]

Can someone explain the point of the extra services of the 9 if they refuse to stop when there are still people waiting at the stops?

Was a attempting to get on a nine this morning headed to Kings buildings and the first (BZL run) service was full, the first extra only could get 5 people on and that left around 20 people left at the stop, however the second extra, upon seeing the first extra still there, simply drove past even though it was nearly empty.

Lothian really need to work on either improving communication or reminding the drivers that the 9 is very very full in the morning and even though there are two buses ahead of them, there may still be people waiting at the stop

The only 'valid' reason I can think of is the driver didn't know it was full, and overtook to pick up further along the route - if it's got no rear window it's difficult to judge. Still doesn't change the fact it should have waited if so many people were at the stop which *is* obvious.

 

[computerSaysNo]

A couple of interesting things I've noticed on the tracking today.
Bus 171 (SN60EOD) (a single-deck B7RLE/Urban 2) is tracking on the 24 which, if accurate, would be very unusual as the 24 is usually double-deckers only.

Bus 709(e) (SF74YMH) (a new BZL electric) is tracking on route 31 which I found interesting. My thoughts are either they were short of a bus and were confident enough that the electric vehicle has the range to complete the block (is that the right term? Vehicles complete blocks and drivers complete ??), or that placing an electric vehicle on the 31 was deliberate in order to evaluate its performance.

I've also noticed that route 22, since moving from Central to Longstone garage, seems to have a mix of vehicle types and to me it feels like a "whatever we've got left" sort of deal. For example today it has three of the 15-plate B5TL/Gemini 3s ("G3"), one 17-plate B5TL/G3 (red exterior but blue Skylink interior), and one 15-plate B5LH/G3 (diesel-electric hybrid).
When I checked a few minutes ago there was also one of the single-door short ex-London vehicles tracking on the 22 but after refreshing it's showing as operating only until 0930hrs so I guess it was a peak extra.

This is all from using "Rare" or "22" in the search in https://lvf.io/#LRT. Be aware that 1: you may need to create an account and log in in order to use the search function, and 2: data found with the above searches is displayed live therefore searching at a later time/date will likely yield different results to those I found.

 

[Bus9120UK]

A couple of interesting things I've noticed on the tracking today.
Bus 171 (SN60EOD) (a single-deck B7RLE/Urban 2) is tracking on the 24 which, if accurate, would be very unusual as the 24 is usually double-deckers only.

Bus 709(e) (SF74YMH) (a new BZL electric) is tracking on route 31 which I found interesting. My thoughts are either they were short of a bus and were confident enough that the electric vehicle has the range to complete the block (is that the right term? Vehicles complete blocks and drivers complete ??), or that placing an electric vehicle on the 31 was deliberate in order to evaluate its performance.

I've also noticed that route 22, since moving from Central to Longstone garage, seems to have a mix of vehicle types and to me it feels like a "whatever we've got left" sort of deal. For example today it has three of the 15-plate B5TL/Gemini 3s ("G3"), one 17-plate B5TL/G3 (red exterior but blue Skylink interior), and one 15-plate B5LH/G3 (diesel-electric hybrid).
When I checked a few minutes ago there was also one of the single-door short ex-London vehicles tracking on the 22 but after refreshing it's showing as operating only until 0930hrs so I guess it was a peak extra.

This is all from using "Rare" or "22" in the search in https://lvf.io/#LRT. Be aware that 1: you may need to create an account and log in in order to use the search function, and 2: data found with the above searches is displayed live therefore searching at a later time/date will likely yield different results to those I found.

171 is a typo. It's tracking by estimated location as its not actually on the route. It's TB7 of course.

 

[computerSaysNo]

171 is a typo. It's tracking by estimated location as its not actually on the route. It's TB7 of course.

Ah right, I don't know offhand what fleet numbers the training fleet used to be.

 

[Bus9120UK]

Ah right, I don't know offhand what fleet numbers the training fleet used to be.

They are 167-170, 174/5 and 171 in order of TB1-TB7.

Bus 445 is the bus on the route.

 

[CN04NRJ]

Bus 709(e) (SF74YMH) (a new BZL electric) is tracking on route 31 which I found interesting. My thoughts are either they were short of a bus and were confident enough that the electric vehicle has the range to complete the block (is that the right term? Vehicles complete blocks and drivers complete ??), or that placing an electric vehicle on the 31 was deliberate in order to evaluate its performance.

They can complete the blocks (drivers have duties containing what segment of the block they're working), probably a case of the original bus being defective and 709 was available to get the 'block' to leave the garage on time. Allocating the correct type is priority, but making sure the bus gets out in time is usually the main priority.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

They can complete the blocks (drivers have duties containing what segment of the block they're working), probably a case of the original bus being defective and 709 was available to get the 'block' to leave the garage on time. Allocating the correct type is priority, but making sure the bus gets out in time is usually the main priority.

A secondary benefit could also be that you get a better picture of how it’s performing on the more challenging routes, such as the 31. Clearly these are not suitable at the moment, but in time a larger example with a longer range could be. The 31 of course has a number of hills and is a longer route in both distance and time, diagrams included.

You’re right though it’s just a case of making sure that the rota is covered by a bus at all, whatever it may be.

 

[ScotRail158725]

I take it Airlink is running fine again with enough vehicles, 1131 is in Musselburgh on driver training

 

[CN04NRJ]

A secondary benefit could also be that you get a better picture of how it’s performing on the more challenging routes, such as the 31. Clearly these are not suitable at the moment, but in time a larger example with a longer range could be. The 31 of course has a number of hills and is a longer route in both distance and time, diagrams included.

You’re right though it’s just a case of making sure that the rota is covered by a bus at all, whatever it may be.

Even if it's on one of the very long blocks and reaches low charge, it can always be swapped later on in the day as buses come available/back to the garage.

 

[Busman757]

Saw 428 all rubbed down for paint yesterday. Looked like it was heading to Ferrymill for repaint. Onwards to LC perhaps?

 

[Bus9120UK]

Saw 428 all rubbed down for paint yesterday. Looked like it was heading to Ferrymill for repaint. Onwards to LC perhaps?

Fresh madder coating. As they are now at Longstone they are able to put them off for paint, which is much needed. It swapped for 427 which should be ready for service again tomorrow.

 

[CN04NRJ]

Saw 428 all rubbed down for paint yesterday. Looked like it was heading to Ferrymill for repaint. Onwards to LC perhaps?

I'm led to believe that it'll be 600s headed for LCB and/or ECB. They're the perfect candidates really.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

I'm led to believe that it'll be 600s headed for LCB and/or ECB. They're the perfect candidates really.

The East Coast fleet will be fully B5TLs in the near future in terms of double decks.

 

[ScotRail158725]

I'm led to believe that it'll be 600s headed for LCB and/or ECB. They're the perfect candidates really.

Assuming 681-698 look most likely being displaced from Central and the lower mileage than Longstones ones

 

[computerSaysNo]

The East Coast fleet will be fully B5TLs in the near future in terms of double decks.

What is your intended timescale in using the term "near future"? As part/as a result of the introduction of the current batch of electric buses?

Will the East Coast B9TLs be removed from service entirely? I'd think given their age they still have life left in them, but I definitely would move them to something easy at a City garage instead of the mechanically-taxing routes in East and West Lothian. But management might not see the point in repainting them if they've only got a few years left, which is understandable.

I don't suppose anyone knows and is able to say what the rough milage of the (2010) East Coast B9s and 2011 City B9s is? Might be interesting to compare to the milage the 2009 B9s had before resale.

 

[stevenedin]

Assuming 681-698 look most likely being displaced from Central and the lower mileage than Longstones ones

This wouldn’t completely replace 841-850, 929-931 & 933-950.

 

[computerSaysNo]

This wouldn’t completely replace 841-850, 929-931 & 933-950.

If the priority was felt to be to standardise the East Coast double deck fleet to B5TL vehicles then B5/400MMCs could be sent to East Scotland releasing the 2010 B9TLs to go to Country, replacing the 2008 B9TLs and providing an increase in vehicles for a service increase?