Most hated rolling stock

[317666]

The 317s should be kept on the Hertford and Moorgate services, and the slow services to Welwyn.

Have fun getting one past Drayton Park!

My personal least favourite train is the Class 172, although I hate all Turbostars and Electrostars, they stand out as being the worst. Horrid seats, bad ride quality, annoying vibrations/buzzing noise above second gear or so. They are a major step backwards from the 150s they replaced, which at least had soft seats, good ride quality and a likeable engine noise!

 

[Qwerty133]

The seats are the most comfortable (non-preserved) on the network.

The ride is nice and quiet.

The toilets are a pleasure to defocate in.

That is all.

I know seats are a matter of personal choice but I find meridian and emt 158 seats quite a lot more comfortable than the.
If you call banging in to the next coach repetitively 'nice' or 'quiet' then they are.
And I don't know or particularly care about the toilets.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Have fun getting one past Drayton Park!

My personal least favourite train is the Class 172, although I hate all Turbostars and Electrostars, they stand out as being the worst. Horrid seats, bad ride quality, annoying vibrations/buzzing noise above second gear or so. They are a major step backwards from the 150s they replaced, which at least had soft seats, good ride quality and a likeable engine noise!

Yes the LM172s are worse than the LM170s however they are still very nice units and I am sure than northern would happily have some of the 172s and return there share of the 150s to you.

 

[Robinson]

I've never liked the 334s personally. Cramped seating, unreliable toilets and for the enthusiast in me, just a bit soulless (though I accept this isn't everybody's priority!)

Another vote for the 158s from me as well. I still remember the first time I travelled on one of them - the entire floor and seat vibrated continuously whenever the engines were on. Give me a 170 any day of the week!

 

[61653 HTAFC]

This might be controversial, but (given the OP's request to not bash pacers or voyagers) I'd like to nominate the 333s for the following reasons:

A) They really could do with a refresh now, it's hard work to find a seat that isn't caked in someone else's hair product and grease.

B) the seating layout is very irritating- 3+2 seating is a pain because firstly at busy times there's inadequate standing room, but in the off peak none of the seats are particularly pleasant places to be because they're packed in so tightly. It's also annoying that the bays of 3 are all face to face, but the bays of 2 are almost all airline (with inadequate legroom).

C) The toilets. Even on the occasions that they work, they stink to high heaven!

D) The horrible Northern/Metro hybrid livery (shared with the 3 bins) that looks like they were only half finished when they had to be back in service. The current Northern livery is sleek and attractive (and hides a lot of dirt!) and would suit the 333s far better. Given that Northern is now so close to having a unified fleet, livery wise, it's a shame that there are these 19 anomalies in WY.

 

[Yew]

The seats are the most comfortable (non-preserved) on the network.

The ride is nice and quiet.

The toilets are a pleasure to defocate in.

That is all.

I know seats are a matter of personal choice but I find meridian and emt 158 seats quite a lot more comfortable than the.
If you call banging in to the next coach repetitively 'nice' or 'quiet' then they are.
And I don't know or particularly care about the toilets.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Have fun getting one past Drayton Park!

My personal least favourite train is the Class 172, although I hate all Turbostars and Electrostars, they stand out as being the worst. Horrid seats, bad ride quality, annoying vibrations/buzzing noise above second gear or so. They are a major step backwards from the 150s they replaced, which at least had soft seats, good ride quality and a likeable engine noise!

Yes the LM172s are worse than the LM170s however they are still very nice units and I am sure than northern would happily have some of the 172s and return there share of the 150s to you.

There is a bit of noise starting off. But not that much,, and it's better tha sitting on a Diesel engine, as its quiet when up at speed. However it is a shame some thing can't be done about the squeak from the corridors.

 

[yorksrob]

I know seats are a matter of personal choice but I find meridian and emt 158 seats quite a lot more comfortable than the.
If you call banging in to the next coach repetitively 'nice' or 'quiet' then they are.
And I don't know or particularly care about the toilets.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Yes the LM172s are worse than the LM170s however they are still very nice units and I am sure than northern would happily have some of the 172s and return there share of the 150s to you.

Can't say as I've noticed the carriages bumping into eachother. The odd thud from slamming doors now and again but nothing to offset the superior levels of comfort and ambiance.

 

[185143]

Pacers, horrible decrepid relics from an age well past and spending a 10 shift working them is hell

Fair point!

 

[87015]

90s. Most upsetting seeing one on approach or the square grills shoving in...

 

[Oswyntail]

.....
D) The horrible Northern/Metro hybrid livery (shared with the 3 bins) that looks like they were only half finished when they had to be back in service. The current Northern livery is sleek and attractive (and hides a lot of dirt!) and would suit the 333s far better. Given that Northern is now so close to having a unified fleet, livery wise, it's a shame that there are these 19 anomalies in WY.

Without wishing to stray off topic, the deep red of the 333 livery is the best bit of it. The current Northern livery is, on the other hand, utterly misconceived, vile, and only just better than the awful Arriva mess that preceded it.
Which only goes to show - de gustibus non est disputandum.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Pacers, horrible decrepit relics from an age well past and spending a 10 shift working them is hell

How on earth, with my well-recorded reputation of utterly detesting one certain form of rail unit still running, have I missed this thread until now...hock:

Class 142 Pacers...especially those with a past connection to the Merseytravel area.

 

[Lrd]

Not a big fan of 321s, they just seem boring and basic, they just don't do anything great.

 

[90sWereBetter]

Greater Anglia's 153s are pretty horrible.

And the condition of some of the C Stock trains at the moment is shocking. Yes, I know they don't have long left in service, but they should at least touch up the exterior just enough to make them look presentable. The one I caught from Baker Street to Paddington back in February had a set of doors which had NO paint whatsoever left on them. :roll:

I don't mind the S Stock. Not a patch on the trusty A Stock, but a lot better than what I was fearing.

 

[LE Greys]

What's wrong with the 313s? I prefer them to the 315s on the Greater Anglia line, they at least have nice seats... they could do with a bit of a clean and a PIS installing but they do the job

Frankly, any unit that ran alongside Deltics has no place on the railway today. They still do a worthwhile job, and perhaps a heavy refurb would be helpful, but its about time they were replaced with something a bit less ancient. I'm not holding my breath, though, 302s managed 40 years in service.
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I detest the 317s employed by FCC. It infuriates me when I get to KX and I see a 317 waiting for me! From five o'clock onwards, we deserve proper units (such as 365 Networkers, or even 321s). The 317s should be kept on the Hertford and Moorgate services, and the slow services to Welwyn. They just don't cut the mustard for Letchworth, Royston and Cambridge commuters!

I'd agree with you there. The way the doors rattle when one meets an Electra in the Welwyn Tunnels has an alarming effect on my nerves. However, the compensation is that they make a nice noise, so I've been known to reject a Networker at Cambridge if I know a 317 is available (no tunnels on that section, of course). The 321s seem to have cleaned up better, though.

 

[306024]

Not a big fan of 321s, they just seem boring and basic, they just don't do anything great.

Boring and basic every time for me. Reasonably reliable and can get a shift on with a keen driver. Conveying 1,000s in and out of London every day is quite great

Dislikes - Any unit with insufficient axles.

 

[Starmill]

Doesn't look like I'm the first one to say it, and I doubt I'll be the last:

I cannot stand 142s. I find the ex-Merseyrail ones to be a particular anathema.

 

[8J]

I agree with 507 001 about the 507/8's. Fine units considering their age and the battering they take.

I don't like TPE 185's. Soulless and boring are under statements..

 

[ainsworth74]

I agree with 507 001 about the 507/8's. Fine units considering their age and the battering they take.

Though they have literally the worst interior layout of any train I've ever encountered. I don't think a single bay of seating properly lines up with the windows! At least nearly all the seats on 185s line up with the windows.

 

[8J]

Considering they are used for urban/metro style services, the more seats that can be integrated, the better. Having worked on the 507/8's, I can however say that my only gripe is the inconsistency of the units. Some are great (hence my username) and some are terrible.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I remember the overhauls of the 507/508s well as I was studying in Ormskirk at the time, and was pretty impressed at the finished job- the fact that most non-enthusiasts were convinced they were new trains says it all. That said, I haven't been over that way for a while so maybe they're starting to show their age again now. Besides the aforementioned 333s, Northern's 150s are the ones that do my head in- they're so inconsistently fitted out and despite being a good few years newer than the 507/508s they seem ancient in comparison. They need a 'proper' overhaul and standardisation rather than the 'make-do & mend' enforced by Northern's 'No Growth' franchise terms.

 

[The Ham]

I'm surprised that IEP's have been bashed on this thread yet.

 

[185143]

I don't like TPE 185's. Soulless and boring are under statements..[/QUOTE]
I don't like desiros in general-theyre too similar

 

[broadgage]

I'm surprised that IEP's have been bashed on this thread yet.

Well, I was about to nominate the wretched IEP, but was not sure if we could only vote for a presently existing, rather than a proposed train.

IEP, too short for expected passenger numbers. The longer variant is only one coach more than the present HSTs many of which are grossly overcrowded. Many will be shorter.

Seating mainly bus style with limited legroom, comparable to airline seating rather than proper trains. A respected member of these forums stated IIRC "you cant expect 1950s seat spacing on a modern train" isnt progress wonderful !

Reliability remains to be seen, but given the complexity of the computer systems on modern trains I forsee a lot of problems. Also route restricted, so more busses at weekends because the new trains wont be able to use alternative routes.

 

[sprinterguy]

IEP, too short for expected passenger numbers. The longer variant is only one coach more than the present HSTs many of which are grossly overcrowded. Many will be shorter.

Not that we need another IEP debate, but:

The longer carriages of the IEP mean that a 9-car IEP train will be longer than an entire 2+8 HST formation, including power cars. A 9-car IEP is also likely to have between 510 and 526 standard class seats, compared to 387 on FGW’s long distance HST sets or 465 on the “Super high density” sets.

The 5-car IEP sets are, hopefully, destined for the routes whose levels of demand do not fill a whole HST at all times, such as Cheltenham and Worcester, and it will be possible to double up the 5-car sets at busy times.

 

[ainsworth74]

Considering they are used for urban/metro style services, the more seats that can be integrated, the better.

But they don't have that many seats, if they were going for seats above all else surely they'd have fitted 2+3 rather than 2+2. As there is plenty of standing room I think that they weren't bothered about fitting lots of seats but boosting standing space. I just found incredible that the design was so poor that not one bay of seats seemed to line up properly.

I remember the overhauls of the 507/508s well as I was studying in Ormskirk at the time, and was pretty impressed at the finished job- the fact that most non-enthusiasts were convinced they were new trains says it all.

I'm not criticising the quality of the interior work, the units I was on were still in very good condition, and Merseyrail deserve credit for that. Just wish they had thought a bit more about seat/window alignment.

 

[Hyphen]

(with apologies to the OP)

Voyagers.

Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers.

And you can throw Meridians in there too - whilst they're a better attempt at what Voyagers should have been, the seats cause me severe back pain.

In fact, when travelling from Sheffield to Swansea, you seem to have little choice but to take a Voyager or Meridian, but I invariably alight at Derby to await the slower 170 going southwards. Adds journey time, but I have legroom, mobile signal and I'm otherwise happier.

 

[DarloRich]

(with apologies to the OP)

Voyagers.

Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers.

They are the most hideously disgusting pieces of sheet it has ever been my misfortunate to travel on. They are the worst trains not only in this country but in any country.

Every component within them appears to have been designed, by some sort of perverted genius, to resonate at a slightly different frequency thus ensuring that even when you get used to one rattle another appears to drive you round the bend. The tables are to small to use to do any work on once more than one other person joins you at a table seat, the airline seats are almost useless for work, or for even sitting in, the phone reception and mobile internet reception is shockingly bad, about 4 of the fleet have WIFI and the cost makes it a rip off, there is almost no provision for refreshments, other than a scabby trolley which tends to have nothing left and only tepid water for a brew, at best. In many of the seats you get a fantastic view of white, rattley, plastic land as you speed about the country. You cant even sit still because the under floor engines vibrate so much the bloody table moves about and they create a terribly invasive and frankly maddening noise.

On the few occasions I have been lucky enough to get a seat I find the seats thin, cramped, uncomfortable, padded by half of yesterdays Times and formed out of a lump of cheap plastic that seems designed to cut the circulation to your legs off after exactly 1 hour, 19 minutes and 42 seconds. The interiors are dark and dingy and seemed to have been designed by a committee of communist, solitary confinement specialising interior decorators. The bloody reservation system is a shambles, they cart about 1st class with 2 people in and they are absolutely useless for long distance travel. That and they smell of cooked excrement. I, for one, have spent my last Friday evening ( or Sunday evening) standing, or more correctly being wedged, for several hours next to a toilet breathing in someone else’s bum fumes having paid XC a kings ransom for the dubious “privilege” of being conveyed by one of their mobile ordure tubes.


I am sure someone will be along shortly to express what a luddite I am, how this is the 21st century railway and that no one travels long distance on them or some other total and utter wibble. I, frankly, don’t care what you think. I travel long distances on them on a regular basis. They are truly, truly terrible, and you are wrong.


So: Seconded Mr Chairman. Any objections? Motion carried. Meeting closed.

 

[khib70]

I don't like TPE 185's. Soulless and boring are under statements..

Seconded - plus, uncomfortable, noisy, over-engineered, poor interior design and totally inadequate for intercity journeys. Would ten times rather travel on a Voyager....

 

[DarloRich]

Seconded - plus, uncomfortable, noisy, over-engineered, poor interior design and totally inadequate for intercity journeys. Would ten times rather travel on a Voyager....

You are a fool then aren’t you

The 185 is an eminently better vehicle, the seats are more comfortable, the seats line up with the windows, the tables allow work on your laptop even if the train is full. Rarely, if ever, have I had to breath in the pooh fumes of another via the inadequate toilet system and my lap top screen doesn’t bounce about like it does on a Voyager. They rattle less, vibrate less, are less noisy and are a nicer place to be. That said I don’t think they are suitable for the Mancehster – Scotland run, but then they were never designed for that route.

 

[Qwerty133]

(with apologies to the OP)

Voyagers.

Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers. Voyagers.

And you can throw Meridians in there too - whilst they're a better attempt at what Voyagers should have been, the seats cause me severe back pain.

In fact, when travelling from Sheffield to Swansea, you seem to have little choice but to take a Voyager or Meridian, but I invariably alight at Derby to await the slower 170 going southwards. Adds journey time, but I have legroom, mobile signal and I'm otherwise happier.

If meridian seats give you back ache it will be caused by the slouching that hst seats are designed for.

 

[Oswyntail]

....And you can throw Meridians in there too - whilst they're a better attempt at what Voyagers should have been, the seats cause me severe back pain.....

And therein lies the heart of this little discussion. What is uncomfortable to you may well be fine to me - I have tiny little legs, so legroom and "fore and aft" dimensions are never a problem - but I am (ahem) slightly broad, so narrow seats are a pain unless the one next to me is empty. I am also deaf and don't use a laptop on the train, and I have never noticed a strong pong, so I don't think Voyagers are too bad.
I think Darlo doesn't like Voyagers.