Northern Pacer Withdrawals - Info?

[AMD]

Because of social distancing requirements, Northern guards have been instructed not to lock out units unnecessarily - they should only be locked out if there's a fault, or if required for short platforms. For example a Manchester Victoria to Kirkby service should be fully unlocked until Wigan Wallgate, then after there passengers should be on the front unit only.

The official Northern procedure is all carriages are available towards Kirkby, and 'Long Train Short Platform' process is used where there are passenger doors off the platform. On the return journey the rear unit MUST be locked out between Kirkby and Pemberton only. Any guard locking out vehicles (other than with authorisation from control) are in breach of policy. It's something that is a bit of a hot potato with Conductor managers at the moment as there have been a number of customer complaints.

 

[bengley]

The official Northern procedure is all carriages are available towards Kirkby, and 'Long Train Short Platform' process is used where there are passenger doors off the platform. On the return journey the rear unit MUST be locked out between Kirkby and Pemberton only. Any guard locking out vehicles (other than with authorisation from control) are in breach of policy. It's something that is a bit of a hot potato with Conductor managers at the moment as there have been a number of customer complaints.

Interesting - I assumed it was acceptable to entirely lock out the rear unit after Wigan en route to Kirkby.

I am one of the complainants - I've been forced to travel in the front unit several times between Manchester and Wigan and very little space has been available to keep my distance from other passengers.

My friend travelled on a 150/142 combo last night on a service from Manchester to Wigan NW and the pacer was locked out with the lights off, but the guard was working it from the pacer.

 

[sprinterguy]

And those 223 replacement carriages are all 23m long, giving a total length of 223*23=5130m. The 214 Pacer carriages were only 16m, so their total length was 214*16=3420m. Arguably a 50% increase in capacity!

Still to enter service are the eight 769s, each comprising 4*20m carriages. That makes a further 32*20=640m, which will increase the total length of replacement diesel trains to 169% of that of the Pacer fleet.

The 150s that have been cascaded in from the Midlands and GW are not included in this calculation. On the other hand, the 153s are presumably still going to leave at some point.

Indeed, a 3-car class 195 is equivalent (Slightly longer in fact) in length to a pair of Pacers. Though on services that operate with only a single unit then a new 195 can still only replace a single Pacer.

Must admit I completely forgot about the additional 150s from West Mids/GWR!

 

[IamTrainsYT]

Yes so in this case the guard was right to have the unit locked out. If this happens East of Wigan it's usually not allowed.

Before lockdown, I had a guard that took a service all the way to Kirkby in the 142. The first 2 stations he climbed down the steps onto the ramp at the end of the platform, before then moving to the middle doors to unlock from there

 

[kingston_toon]

Before lockdown, I had a guard that took a service all the way to Kirkby in the 142. The first 2 stations he climbed down the steps onto the ramp at the end of the platform, before then moving to the middle doors to unlock from there

I took a bash Manchester Victoria - Kirkby - Wigan Wallgate in 142004 during July and sat in the Pacer all the way both directions (with a fair few others). Was that unusual then? I didn't pay too much attention to operation on the Kirkby branch alas but people certainly did board / alight at all stops.

 

[warwickshire]

I took a bash Manchester Victoria - Kirkby - Wigan Wallgate in 142004 during July and sat in the Pacer all the way both directions (with a fair few others). Was that unusual then? I didn't pay too much attention to operation on the Kirkby branch alas but people certainly did board / alight at all stops.

No also occurred in third Thursday in July off this year 2020 aboard 142087 on the 0915 Manchester Victoria to kirkby so doubled back to Manchester Piccadilly and did the 1040 to rose Hill Marple with 142065

 

[warwickshire]

According to the real times website only 142094 on the 0556 Chester to Manchester Piccadilly and ecs to Chester. Followed by 142018 on the am rosehill am diagramm and 142078 which starts at Wigan and ends at Manchester Victoria is the only 3 class 142s out today.
All else is a two car 150.
Nothing it appears has come off newton Heath T.M.D.
Unless Realtime time trains hasn't had the proper 142 allocations added to it.
With also Manchester and surrounds areas 142s serve most likely going to a tier 3. Have the 142s been withdrawn out off service early. Before December the 12th. Maybe?

 

[jonnyfan]

It's possible the 142s need some maintenance, seeing as we're coming to the end of leaf fall season, they will have ended up with plenty of wheel flats that will need sorting

 

[175001]

Tomorrow reportedly the last day of 142 diagrams.

 

[47827]

Tomorrow reportedly the last day of 142 diagrams.

With Manchester going into tier 3 next week that's a plausible reason this could be happening as people will pushed against public transport use meaning a few services could possibly go down to 2 car and release the pacers early.

 

[Jamesrob637]

With Manchester going into tier 3 next week that's a plausible reason this could be happening as people will pushed against public transport use meaning a few services could possibly go down to 2 car and release the pacers early.

Which is s crass decision as GM may go into T2 if infection rates continue to fall.

 

[skyhigh]

I wouldn't be surprised if wheelsets were at scrap size now, leading to the withdrawals - as far as I know there's very few, if any, spares left.

 

[jonnyfan]

I wouldn't be surprised if wheelsets were at scrap size now, leading to the withdrawals - as far as I know there's very few, if any, spares left.

From what I've heard that sounds very plausible

 

[skyhigh]

Confirmation from a reliable source that the wheels are pretty much done, and one decent slide could effectively be enough to write a unit off at this point. Given that they still need to be able to run around for storage moves etc it probably means it's not worth the risk in putting them out now.

I believe manufacturing of spare wheelsets was wound down ahead of the intended withdrawal date - the extension of which means that spares are pretty much exhausted.

 

[KvW]

A sad day if this is true. This is a shot of 078 on Saturday evening at Ince. I'm glad I ventured out. 018, 065, 058, 078 and 087 were in action. Needless to say any info about tomorrow's workings would be appreciated. Kev.

 

[warwickshire]

A sad day if this is true. This is a shot of 078 on Saturday evening at Ince. I'm glad I ventured out. 018, 065, 058, 078 and 087 were in action. Needless to say any info about tomorrow's workings would be appreciated. Kev.

I believe the 0913 1215 1513 Manchester Victoria to Kirkby is the diagram

 

[warwickshire]

Confirmation from a reliable source that the wheels are pretty much done, and one decent slide could effectively be enough to write a unit off at this point. Given that they still need to be able to run around for storage moves etc it probably means it's not worth the risk in putting them out now.

I believe manufacturing of spare wheelsets was wound down ahead of the intended withdrawal date - the extension of which means that spares are pretty much exhausted.

It's a pity they only had two weeks to go. Such a shame. Hopefully maybe a odd one or two might remain.

 

[47827]

Which is s crass decision as GM may go into T2 if infection rates continue to fall.

The so called tier review falls in mid December about the same time that last sets were due to be gone anyway. Regardless of the decisonal merits or otherwise of what is going on its highly unlikely the blonde one in number 10 will bother reviewing it any earlier unless it was for tightening of restrictions again looking at recent events.

Whilst I've not been on one in several years I'm sad to hear this and it sounds like they will slip into the night (possibly literally) and onto storage sites for disposal as directed in the coming months without the send off most trains get these days.

 

[Liverpool 507]

142004 is already allocated to Kirkby - Manchester Victoria services tomorrow with 150225 on Realtime Trains.

 

[scrapy]

I believe the 0913 1215 1513 Manchester Victoria to Kirkby is the diagram

Yes appears to work 16.36 back from Kirkby to Man Vic then empty stock to Newton Heath.

 

[Muenchener]

Posted in error.

 

[AMD]

The regional director has confirmed on the internal FB group that 142004 leaving Victoria on the 1515 to Kirkby is the last 142 departure from Manchester.

 

[WesternLancer]

The regional director has confirmed on the internal FB group that 142004 leaving Victoria on the 1515 to Kirkby is the last 142 departure from Manchester.

Were there detonators? one would like to think so!

 

[Jamesrob637]

A mate is on 142004 and says it's packed!

 

[WesternLancer]

A mate is on 142004 and says it's packed!

empty in the 150?

 

[Paul_10]

It is a bit of a shame they probably did not get the send off that I think the trains would of warranted but I think the enthusiasts should be grateful they got one more year out and of them which was fairly enexpected.

Of course the true end of an era is when the last remaining sets are either sent off for scrap or preservation, that very last pacer run will no doubt have people out in droves.

 

[HST43257]

It is a bit of a shame they probably did not get the send off that I think the trains would of warranted

I would’ve loved it if they’d done a special 1 time only 4 car pacer on the Southport to Stalybridhe as they can run alone on there

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Just been featured on the 6.30 p.m. BBC1 North West local news programme. Was mentioned that it wasn't pre-advertised to try to ensure that this last ever Pacer service wasn't packed out.

 

[WesternLancer]

BBC radio 4 news claiming "the last pacer" left Kirkby this afternoon!

Are there not still 144s with Northern elsewhere?

 

[507021]

BBC radio 4 news claiming "the last pacer" left Kirkby this afternoon!

Are there not still 144s with Northern elsewhere?

No, they've not been in service for several months.