Questions about driving trains.

[W230]

Thanks, Notadriver. The MR part should have been a clue, as in MRPIC.

And to add to the fun, lots of the acronyms will be slightly different on different stock. 319s have Low Main Air Governors (as opposed to the MRG - same thing though). 377's have MRPCC instead of MRPIC...

 

[455driver]

Dont confuse the MRPIC with the MRIC, although what is in fact the MRPIC is called the MRIC on some stock.

Or confuse the Parking Brake Application Cock (455) for the Main Res Dump Cock (458) which both do the same thing. Clear as mud isnt it!

 

[PG]

For Pete's sake - what's wrong with calling a spade a spade!

Are train builders now equipping their latest creations with Non-visual advance warning devices? or to you and me a horn

 

[jopsuk]

PG: given some of the classes mentioned it is clear that this was going on in the 80s/pre-privatisation 90s.

 

[A-driver]

For Pete's sake - what's wrong with calling a spade a spade!

Are train builders now equipping their latest creations with Non-visual advance warning devices? or to you and me a horn

I have often wondered why they insist on changing terminology. I'm sure it's some manager somewhere trying to make a name for himself by redefining terminology!

Even under BR terms were changed. For example units were built and labeled the the 'IC' for isolation cock at the end (PBIC, MRIC, DIC, BRIC etc). Then they built the 456 and 321 and someone decided it necessary to label certain systems as 'ICBR, ICPB' but still leave others as 'CDIC' for no obvious reason!

And then there is the labeling of MU coaches. Most units being things like DT, PMOS, TOC, DMOS etc... then they build the 321 and for no reason they rename what is the TOS coach in any other unit to an ATS (aux trailer). What exactly is the point?! Seems to be just to make life for us harder.

 

[DunfordBridge]

I can hazard a guess as to what most of these acronyms mean, eg, BRIC for Brake Reservoir Isolating Cock, but DIC and CDIC leave me somewhat clueless.
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Or confuse the Parking Brake Application Cock (455) for the Main Res Dump Cock (458) which both do the same thing. Clear as mud isnt it!

I think PBAC would appear to be the more obvious of the two for applying the parking brake.
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Actually, A-Driver, I am not as clueless as I had thought, I think DIC and CDIC will be Door Isolating Cock and Cab Door Isolating Cock respectively.

 

[notadriver]

There's too much talk of cocks in this thread for my liking ??????. Oh come on someone had to say it

 

[Lincoln_biker]

I'll join notadriver in the game of double entendre volleyball and guffaw at the Main Res Dump. Ell-Oh-Ell...

 

[DXMachina]

if DIC & CDIC both refer to cocks, someone's really been cocking around with the acronyms

 

[TDK]

if DIC & CDIC both refer to cocks, someone's really been cocking around with the acronyms

DIC is door isolation cock

 

[DunfordBridge]

I can see how there is the potential for some of the more sensitive passengers to be offended if they heard a driver talking about his actions to stem an air leak around the vestibule when securing a door out of use. I would love to see how customer services would explain that one.

 

[455driver]

DIC is door isolation cock

A 12 coach train with 4 doors per coach will have 48 DICs on the train, it always seems there are more than that for some reason!

 

[jon0844]

A 12 coach train with 4 doors per coach will have 48 DICs on the train, it always seems there are more than that for some reason!

I'm sure I've seen many more DICs than that even on a 3 car train. Especially late at night!

 

[Eagle]

So you're saying that a DIC is one of many kinds of cock?

 

[1e10]

I am interested in the 'steps' (a word I see her a lot) used for accelerating and breaking.

Can anyone tell me roughly how many different steps the average traction will have?
What steps will a driver typically use when breaking?
How hard will a driver accelerate from a standstill?
How hard will a driver accelerate if already at speed and needs to speed up?

 

[Eagle]

We discussed this question on the first couple of pages of the thread.

 

[evoluzione]

Everything I drive 14x & 15x has the following:

5 Step Brake
Release - Step 1 - Step 2 - Step 3 - Emergency
If you select Emergency you won't get the brake back off until under 3mph, it also automatically applies sand.

Normal braking is step 1 and 2, in this weather I try and avoid using step 2 totally.

8 Notch Power Handle
Off - 1- 7

Normal pulling away is 3 until abut 5mph - 5 until 10 mph then notch 7 depending on permissible speeds, unit, gradient, sometimes notch 2 is enough because of permissible speeds, 2 car 158's don't really move in step 3 so your straight to 5.

We also spend a lot of time with the power off coasting.

 

[A-driver]

Most electric units have as above 5 brake steps, depends on the stock but generally on 365/377 you do most braking in step 1, a splash of 2 during the braking curve is sometimes needed to 'take the wind out the sails' and sometimes on final approach to line up with monitors etc.

On older units like 313/317/321/455/456 etc I find I use step 2 more, especially on the initial brake application and then run back to step 1 once it's under control and use 2 again as needed.

EMUs differ from DMUs with power notches as they pretty much all have 4 notches (5 if you include off). On camshaft units these notches are (off), shunt, series, parallel and weak field. Camshaft units will also hold a speed easier, by going straight into weak field and then 10-15mph before target speed running back to shunt should hold the speed nicely, even uphill.

On units with thyristor controls and modern stock the notches are generally (off), shunt (gets up to 5-10mph), half power, full power, full power add weak field.

 

[david_VI]

With speed limits do you try to be right on the limit, like if it's 90, you drive at 90mph, or do you keep a few mph under the limit, like 88mph.

Does it differ for freight driving techniques? If the limit is 75mph do they really try to get it at 75mph or is it too risky as its easier to go to 76mph when you hit a downhill and have no room to work in?

 

[1e10]

Forgive me if this has already been asked.

What's the longest run a driver can typically be expected to work in terms of distance and time?

 

[Jydo]

Hi, first post here but been looking around the forum for a while.......

Forgive me for asking a dumb question but why isn't the cabs fitted with some device telling them how far they are away from a station? I assume this would maybe make it "too easy" for the driver if they were & maybe question the integrity of train driver training...

Plus, anyone either had or know anyone who has been unfortunate enough to suffer a "one under."

Thanks

 

[TDK]

With speed limits do you try to be right on the limit, like if it's 90, you drive at 90mph, or do you keep a few mph under the limit, like 88mph.

Does it differ for freight driving techniques? If the limit is 75mph do they really try to get it at 75mph or is it too risky as its easier to go to 76mph when you hit a downhill and have no room to work in?

If it's 90mph I do between 88 and 92 and the same for all the speeds
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A 12 coach train with 4 doors per coach will have 48 DICs on the train, it always seems there are more than that for some reason!

Hahaha - I like it
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I am interested in the 'steps' (a word I see her a lot) used for accelerating and breaking.

Can anyone tell me roughly how many different steps the average traction will have?
What steps will a driver typically use when breaking?
How hard will a driver accelerate from a standstill?
How hard will a driver accelerate if already at speed and needs to speed up?

Depends on traction. 1 15x generally has 7 power notches and 4 brake steps not including off. A class 175 does not really have brake steps as it is continuous braking like a slider.

As for driving and steps that all depends on the unit, condition, gradients, signals and stopping places, all drivers are different with their selection of bot brake and power controller, I always brake for a station from speed in and 15x initially in step 1 then step 2, only use step 3 as a back up. With a 175 I normally select initial, 1 bar and then increase to 2 - 3 bar depending on gradient. A driver will accelerate as quick as the unit allows usually selecting the top notch by between 15 and 30mph depending on unit and keep it in full power until just short of the line speed.

 

[GB]

Forgive me for asking a dumb question but why isn't the cabs fitted with some device telling them how far they are away from a station?

There is a new system called "Driver Advisory Sytem" (DAS) that gives the driver various information such as current time, what the next booked station is and an ETA to that station. It then works out a target speed to get there on time and efficiently. It also shows the trains current location in miles and chains.

Not in wide spread use though and is primarily desgined as a fuel saving measure.

A driver will know where the next/nearest station is anyway through his route knowledge.

 

[TDK]

Hi, first post here but been looking around the forum for a while.......

Forgive me for asking a dumb question but why isn't the cabs fitted with some device telling them how far they are away from a station? I assume this would maybe make it "too easy" for the driver if they were & maybe question the integrity of train driver training...

Plus, anyone either had or know anyone who has been unfortunate enough to suffer a "one under."

Thanks

To answer your first question - drivers do not need any enhancement in the cab for stations as they know where they are even in the fog. As for one unders I know over 50 drivers who have had them.
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Forgive me if this has already been asked.

What's the longest run a driver can typically be expected to work in terms of distance and time?

I used to run from Wrexham to Marylebone and when diverted it took over 5 hours, my current company it is about 2 hours and 10 minutes for the longest run in my link

 

[jopsuk]

There is a new system called "Driver Advisory Sytem" (DAS) that gives the driver various information such as current time, what the next booked station is and an ETA to that station. It then works out a target speed to get there on time and efficiently. It also shows the trains current location in miles and chains.

Not in wide spread use though and is primarily desgined as a fuel saving measure.

A driver will know where the next/nearest station is anyway through his route knowledge.

Presumably the ETCS/ERTMS system on the Cambrian gives this sort of information (though in metric)?

 

[1e10]

If it's 90mph I do between 88 and 92 and the same for all the speeds

You're allowed to do 3MPH over the limit right?

 

[A-driver]

You're allowed to do 3MPH over the limit right?

Not 'allowed' but 3mph is generally ignored in a download by managers simply because speedos arnt always bang on, drivers sitting at different heights/standing will see the needle ever so slightly differently and there has to be some margin for error. I have been downloaded at 104mph for a minute or so on 100mph stock and nothing was said at all, they could tell from my driving that it wasn't deliberate or poor concentration.

There is no blanket restriction on speeding, it all depends on what else you are doing at the time. 3mph is often used as a guide though.

 

[Jydo]

I have been downloaded at 104mph for a minute or so on 100mph stock and nothing was said at all, they could tell from my driving that it wasn't deliberate or poor concentration.

Speaking of managers, are bosses (generally) always on your back at most toc's or are you left with a bit of space to get on and do the job? This question is more for experienced drivers rather than trainees/newly qualified.

 

[notadriver]

Talking of which is there anyone here who is either a trainee driver or has less than two years driving experience ?

 

[455driver]

Speaking of managers, are bosses (generally) always on your back at most toc's or are you left with a bit of space to get on and do the job? This question is more for experienced drivers rather than trainees/newly qualified.

If you are doing your job properly then you are left alone (downloads, rides excepted), make a mistake and they will get to the bottom of it and sort it out, extract the wee wee and they will be on your back continuously.