Scotrail Class 385 Discussion

[mde]

To be fair the 385's built in Japan have the same issues

In any case, wasn't the design work done over there?

 

[Domh245]

Weren't the first few 800s (including the units used in the initial public run) ones shipped over from Japan? Nothing to do with Newton Aycliffe.

Correct, but I'm not sure what relevance that has? There are plenty of Newton Aycliffe built trains out in service with GWR (in fact I think only NA built units are currently in service) which the quality of can be inspected and deemed unsatisfactory

But they're not going to Newton Aycliffe, but to Tees export dock.

They're going to Tees export dock where Hitachi have got a storage facility where the shells are stored before going to Newton Aycliffe for fitting out. You can see it on the map here, 80x shells nearer the river, and 385 shells nearer the railway, and if you look at the same site in Google Earth with 3D building enabled you can clearly see the distinctive shapes of the 80x and 385s and pan around them. As @Typhoon_93 says, it is a pre-series unit so it isn't much more than a shell with running gear fitted, so it can be put into store at Tees dock and then taken to NA for internal fit out and sending back to Scotland.

 

[InOban]

Thanks. Obviously it is time for the prototypes to be fitted out.

 

[ainsworth74]

As @Typhoon_93 says, it is a pre-series unit so it isn't much more than a shell with running gear fitted, so it can be put into store at Tees dock and then taken to NA for internal fit out and sending back to Scotland.

Yes that's now my, very much revised, view as to what those moves actually are. Still, it was interesting to have such a move brought to my attention this morning and commence wild speculation!

 

[mde]

Yes that's now my, very much revised, view as to what those moves actually are. Still, it was interesting to have such a move brought to my attention this morning and commence wild speculation!

It's what we do best!

 

[mde]

Yes that's now my, very much revised, view as to what those moves actually are. Still, it was interesting to have such a move brought to my attention this morning and commence wild speculation!

Richard Clinnick has an answer - the 385's are on their way to Pistoia for fit-out. https://twitter.com/Clinnick1/status/990990131304812544

 

[superkev]

In any case, wasn't the design work done over there?

I believe the fronts where designed by a British consultancy.

 

[Mingulay]

Richard Clinick has an answer - the 385's are on their way to Pistoia for fit-out. https://twitter.com/Clinnick1/status/990990131304812544

Cause for optimism. ?

The Dunblane service is now getting quite grim. Short formed this am cancelled tonight. Reason given train failure. This may be the case or is it that train failure is the standard explanation given when there is no train or it's short formed ? Just suspect there is a reluctance to state reason as lack of rolling stock. No doubt someone will know ?

 

[Domh245]

I suppose that sending some to Pistoia isn't entirely outlandish. If Scotrail aren't accepting any of the units then Newton Aycliffe must be getting rather full of the things, and so they'll have shifted these to Pistoia to get them ready to send to Scotland as soon as they've got the windscreen fix ready. Allows them to get them into service a bit quicker than waiting for space to become available at Newton Aycliffe.

 

[IanXC]

Cause for optimism. ?

The Dunblane service is now getting quite grim. Short formed this am cancelled tonight. Reason given train failure. This may be the case or is it that train failure is the standard explanation given when there is no train or it's short formed ? Just suspect there is a reluctance to state reason as lack of rolling stock. No doubt someone will know ?

Take your pick...

https://wiki.openraildata.com/index.php/Darwin:Cancellation_reason_codes_and_text

 

[hexagon789]

Take your pick...

https://wiki.openraildata.com/index.php/Darwin:Cancellation_reason_codes_and_text

No idea they had so many eventualities covered! "Train cancelled due to speed restriction over a bridge" - that can be used often surely.

Don't see a code for lack of available stock though.

 

[Typhoon_93]

I suppose that sending some to Pistoia isn't entirely outlandish. If Scotrail aren't accepting any of the units then Newton Aycliffe must be getting rather full of the things, and so they'll have shifted these to Pistoia to get them ready to send to Scotland as soon as they've got the windscreen fix ready. Allows them to get them into service a bit quicker than waiting for space to become available at Newton Aycliffe.

Two of the four that are heading to Pistoia are in Germany anyway so makes sense. Aycliffe is at capacity with the dam things 18 sets complete in various stages of test and 11 sets in production not to mention the 9 car class 800’s with 6 in test and 5 in production.

 

[Highlandspring]

The Dunblane service is now getting quite grim. Short formed this am cancelled tonight. Reason given train failure. This may be the case or is it that train failure is the standard explanation given when there is no train or it's short formed ? Just suspect there is a reluctance to state reason as lack of rolling stock. No doubt someone will know ?

The boring truth is that there isn’t a grand conspiracy at work behind the scenes; 2P59 1637 Edinburgh - Dunblane and 2P86 1758 Dunblane - Edinburgh were cancelled tonight due to 158738 52 car engine shut down and not restarting.

 

[hexagon789]

The boring truth is that there isn’t a grand conspiracy at work behind the scenes; 2P59 1637 Edinburgh - Dunblane and 2P86 1758 Dunblane - Edinburgh were cancelled tonight due to 158738 52 car engine shut down and not restarting.

Not surprising, at least half the Haymarket 158s sound broken. EMUs can't come soon enough to replace the Haymarket 158s and give a much needed capacity boost.

 

[380101]

I believe the fronts where designed by a British consultancy.

The cab internal layout was designed by a British consultancy company and was based pretty much on the 380 cab layout to ensure easy driver conversion training. The physical cab structure, including the gangway is all Hitatchi's doing.

 

[a_c_skinner]

On a more pedestrian (see what I did there?) level do we take it there is now a windscreen available that doesn't have internal reflections and distortions?

 

[mde]

On a more pedestrian (see what I did there?) level do we take it there is now a windscreen available that doesn't have internal reflections and distortions?

I think they'd be shouting from the rafters if that was the case. Given the contract for that work was handed to KBRS, the telltale would be a 385 visiting Springburn…

 

[Stopper]

The E-G and the Dunblane services are always short formed nowadays. I travel between Linlithgow and Edinburgh and there’s absolutely not a chance in hell of any Linlithgow passenger getting a seat on the way into Edinburgh, even on 6 or 7 car sets.

The Dunblane’s aren’t as busy but are often short-formed. In the really busy section between Linlithgow and Haymarket it’s like being packed in like sardines on the peak services.

The Dunblane’s will improve when the electrics come in terms of capacity, taking Linlithgow and Polmont passengers off those services is a big chunk, probably the 2nd and 4th busiest stops on that line, and also will be getting longer trains. The E-G will likely continue to suffer even with 8-car trains though, the 7-car 380s still have people standing in the mornings.

 

[380101]

On a more pedestrian (see what I did there?) level do we take it there is now a windscreen available that doesn't have internal reflections and distortions?

2 different companies have been developing a new windscreen. One is in Italy and the other Belgium. I imagine that given they are taking some sets to Italy for completion then they'll try the Italian made screen out then. Speaking to someone involved with the 385 project, they are planning on moving the front bulkhead immediately in front of the drivers dash back approx. 100mm to accomodate a flatter screen.

 

[a_c_skinner]

Interesting, I assumed it was a straight swap for an optically better pane if it didn't need a return to the maker.

 

[380101]

Interesting, I assumed it was a straight swap for an optically better pane if it didn't need a return to the maker.

KB Springburn have the contract to do the remedial works once the solution has been tested by Hitatchi. Just hope they do a better job than the sub standard quality of work thats being carried out on the 156 refurbs.

 

[Clansman]

The E-G will likely continue to suffer even with 8-car trains though...

...especially given 8-car operation will only increase the number of standard seats by 16!

 

[scotraildriver]

KB Springburn have the contract to do the remedial works once the solution has been tested by Hitatchi. Just hope they do a better job than the sub standard quality of work thats being carried out on the 156 refurbs.

Indeed! Had the dubious pleasure of the most recent unit 156436, they have actually painted over the cab lights and DAS screen with grey paint!

 

[gsnedders]

KB Springburn have the contract to do the remedial works once the solution has been tested by Hitatchi. Just hope they do a better job than the sub standard quality of work thats being carried out on the 156 refurbs.

Interesting that it's being done there, given presumably it's being done under contract to Hitachi. There again, given capacity at the factories at the moment, not so surprising!

 

[mde]

KB Springburn have the contract to do the remedial works once the solution has been tested by Hitatchi. Just hope they do a better job than the sub standard quality of work thats being carried out on the 156 refurbs.

Yes, having experienced some of that fine quality work (as a pax) it doesn't really fill you with confidence… that said, never judge a book by its cover.

 

[380101]

Indeed! Had the dubious pleasure of the most recent unit 156436, they have actually painted over the cab lights and DAS screen with grey paint!

I've had 2 fresh from KB that had no sun blinds and no TPWS or EBS labels. Whoever in ScotRail accepts them back from KB needs sacked as they clearly have no clue.

 

[energol]

8 car 365 due into Eastfield depot sometime this Thursday.

 

[Highlandspring]

There hasn’t been an NRAP certificate issued yet (or at least there hadn’t been by lunchtime today) so unless it’s signed off and issued by close of play tomorrow I wouldn’t get your hopes up for Thursday......

 

[Sirius]

Does anyone know if Scotrail plan to extend the £13 fare via Bathgate as a result of the delays/365s on their way? It was initially stated to be until the 19th of May.

 

[Domh245]

Alex Hynes was telling the Scottish Parliament this morning that the first new windscreens will be fitted this week, after which it'll head back to Scotland for testing - presumably to check that the optical problems have been fixed. Hopefully following that it'll be swift progress.