• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

The Royal train

Status
Not open for further replies.

Deltic1

Member
Joined
23 Feb 2012
Messages
145
Hi all.
Does anyone happen to know when the royal train is likely to return to Wolverton after it is used on the opening of the new Borders line?
I thought I would go and see it as there is talk of it being moved if the plan to redevelop Wolverton works goes ahead.
Thanks.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
32,288
Location
Scotland
Why don't you have a look on Realtime Trains, I'm sure the data will be on there.

Wait, what's that? It's not on there? I wonder why that is, it's only the transport for our Head of State and a symbol of the Sovereign, I'm sure *nobody* would be interested in that for nefarious reasons.
 
Last edited:

jopsuk

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2008
Messages
12,773
it's so secretive that I can easily find in the press that it will arrive at Newtongrange at 1055 on the day and depart for Tweedbank at 1115. I'm sure if I did more careful searching I could piece together Lizzie's movements for most of the day just from newspaper previews. At that point it's just daft that it's not on RTT...
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
32,288
Location
Scotland
it's so secretive that I can easily find in the press that it will arrive at Newtongrange at 1055 on the day and depart for Tweedbank at 1115. I'm sure if I did more careful searching I could piece together Lizzie's movements for most of the day just from newspaper previews. At that point it's just daft that it's not on RTT...
Yes, you know from public information when it arrives and leaves. You don't know the route or timings (though you can make an informed guess). Nobody outside of the royal protection team or Network Rail *needs* to know more than that. It's the balancing act that is played keeping VIPs safe but the society free(ish).
 

PHILIPE

Veteran Member
Joined
14 Nov 2011
Messages
13,472
Location
Caerphilly
Only rail staff directly concerned with the Royal Train movements are supposed to be in the know and informed personally.
 

A-driver

Established Member
Joined
9 May 2011
Messages
4,482
Only rail staff directly concerned with the Royal Train movements are supposed to be in the know and informed personally.


Staff like the driver and signaller will be informed usually minutes before departure that the train has the queen on board. The amount of time increases with less important. I was told when booking on that prince William would be on my train from Cambridge some hours later. Although I was more told as a manager would be riding up front with me and they wanted the train stopped in a different place in Cambridge platform on the way down. A colleague was told the day before for the same thing but that seemed more because his DM was trying to persuade him to wear shirt and tie and tidy himself up rather than turn up with his usual scruffy hair and untucked polo. I believe the driver choose to remain status quo and told the DM to take him off the diagram if he was that concerned!

One driver taking the queen to Lynn a few years ago gave the royal protection team heart attacks as they had blockaded the 365s leading first class as they do and the very friendly and chatty driver opened the cab-saloon door and introduced himself to her majesty. Apparently she was very friendly but the security guards who had obviously not considered that door to pose any risk all looked incredibly shocked by it! The DM riding up with the driver was also pretty shocked!
 

asylumxl

Established Member
Joined
12 Feb 2009
Messages
4,260
Location
Hiding in your shadow
I think some posters would be surprised how few ****s the general public care about the movements of the Royals.

Regarding Deltic1's original question, I'm guessing you'd be better looking for info on sites more known for "gen". Someone could probably make a pretty good guess from loco movements.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I believe the driver choose to remain status quo and told the DM to take him off the diagram if he was that concerned!

As it should be. The status quo is fine.
 
Last edited:

PHILIPE

Veteran Member
Joined
14 Nov 2011
Messages
13,472
Location
Caerphilly
I recall an incident about 40+ years ago (makes me feel old) when a Driver turned up scruffy (as usual) to work the train and smelling of alcohol (not so strict then), showing scant regard for any instructions from the on board Traction Inspector saying he didn't want the job anyway. When the train had to stop at a station, he was off the footplate like a shot and out of sight to relieve himself of some of his beer. On enquiries why he was on the job rather than a specially selected driver (as was he case at that time), it transpired that at his particular Depot the LDC insisted it was just an additional job and should therefore be covered by the nearest Spare man.
 

jopsuk

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2008
Messages
12,773
Staff like the driver and signaller will be informed usually minutes before departure that the train has the queen on board.

That might be the case for a 365 to Kings Lynn, when it's the actual Royal Train whether being hauled by the diesels or by a steam loco I reckon the driver knows rather further in advance!
 

47271

Established Member
Joined
28 Apr 2015
Messages
2,983
The Royal Train came to Dunkeld a couple of years ago - I think HM was getting driven to Balmoral over the hills via Braemar. Nothing wrong with that, but the stage management of its arrival did make us smile.

The first clue we got was that our very old and rusty 1860s or so Highland Railway design footbridge got repainted, but then the workmen disappeared half way through the job.

The second clue was a team of rude and arrogant policemen unknown to the area searching the car park and stopping us from using certain spaces.

Then we heard that The Train had called. It turned out that the part finished footbridge had been painted precisely so that it looked immaculate to someone of a certain height alighting from a train, and no more...
 

BestWestern

Established Member
Joined
6 Feb 2011
Messages
6,736
I'm curious; why is there deemed a requirement to have a Driver Manager in the cab of a scheduled passenger train if a Royal is on?

What are the crew arrangements for the royal train itself; is it operated by DBS etc? I presume the Drivers are outsourced at least, if not the train itself? Does it have some sort of Guard on board?
 

A-driver

Established Member
Joined
9 May 2011
Messages
4,482
I'm curious; why is there deemed a requirement to have a Driver Manager in the cab of a scheduled passenger train if a Royal is on?



What are the crew arrangements for the royal train itself; is it operated by DBS etc? I presume the Drivers are outsourced at least, if not the train itself? Does it have some sort of Guard on board?


I'm imagining it's more belt and braces against bad press. Imagine the headlines 'train driver flys past red signal with queen onboard', 'train driver attempts to assassinate queen by driving past red signal' etc.

They just like a second pair of eyes in the cab plus the driver manager ha his phone on so can be reached easily by control and re royal protection team etc.

A train with the queen on should not be stopped at signals so in such event the DM will also contact the box whilst the driver approaches the signal.
 

380101

Member
Joined
18 Feb 2015
Messages
1,063
They just like a second pair of eyes in the cab plus the driver manager ha his phone on so can be reached easily by control and re royal protection team etc.
.

Hey wouldn't be a driver manager for long if he did that in our company. He'd be lucky if he got to drop down to drivers grade. More than likely to lose his job for using a mobile phone in an active driving cab whether the Queen is on board or not!
 

infobleep

Veteran Member
Joined
27 Feb 2011
Messages
13,425
Yes, you know from public information when it arrives and leaves. You don't know the route or timings (though you can make an informed guess). Nobody outside of the royal protection team or Network Rail *needs* to know more than that. It's the balancing act that is played keeping VIPs safe but the society free(ish).
Could it's start and departure times be published officially without the route. After all they are in the newspapers?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
That might be the case for a 365 to Kings Lynn, when it's the actual Royal Train whether being hauled by the diesels or by a steam loco I reckon the driver knows rather further in advance!
Do they use steam locos to haul the Royal train?
 

Yabbadabba

Member
Joined
23 May 2014
Messages
385
Train headcode is almost always 1X01

I've signalled the train twice in recent years and the "train" has never used that code or anything that obvious. Because of the press you get to know that HMQ will be in an area that day, but the arrangements for the signaller arrive in time for their shift via a senior (ish) opps manager and they are taken away once the train has passed. In the case of my signalling centre we have a senior opps manager above LOM grade wil be in the box until after the train has passed.
 
Last edited:

sprinterguy

Established Member
Joined
4 Mar 2010
Messages
11,309
Location
Macclesfield
How many Royal train loco's are there in total?
There are two dedicated locos at present that wear the royal claret livery, 67005 and 67006. A third loco, 67026, received a commemorative silver livery celebrating HMs' Diamond Jubilee year in 2012 and has also performed regular royal train duties in recent years.
 

A-driver

Established Member
Joined
9 May 2011
Messages
4,482
Hey wouldn't be a driver manager for long if he did that in our company. He'd be lucky if he got to drop down to drivers grade. More than likely to lose his job for using a mobile phone in an active driving cab whether the Queen is on board or not!


Really? Being that they are on call DMs are expected to have their mobile switched on but on silent when in the cab. They tell you that their phone is on but silent when they get in.
 

380101

Member
Joined
18 Feb 2015
Messages
1,063
Really? Being that they are on call DMs are expected to have their mobile switched on but on silent when in the cab. They tell you that their phone is on but silent when they get in.

We have a driver who was a DTM until he answered his phone in an active cab...he nearly never even got the chance to get a driving job. On call or not, up here the phone goes off and stays off until out the cab. Company policy of no phones on in cabs for all driving grades
 

Freightmaster

Established Member
Joined
7 Jul 2009
Messages
3,812
Train headcode is almost always 1X01
Not sure where this urban myth started, but I have never heard
of it running as 1X01 - certainly not since privatisation.

Why don't you have a look on Realtime Trains, I'm sure the data will be on there.
Although the Royal Train doesn't appear on RTT (or on TRUST/TOPS,
for that matter), it does appear on signalbox train describers,
and by extension, on publicly available 'realtime' signalling maps
such as those on the Railcam and Freightmaster websites...;)

So if you know roughly where the train is likely to be on a given day,
you can follow its progress that way.


MARK
 

Hornet

Member
Joined
16 Jul 2013
Messages
741
Only rail staff directly concerned with the Royal Train movements are supposed to be in the know and informed personally.

I was an S&T Tech at Slough during the '70's. The Royal Train would occasionally arrive or depart Slough, using Platform 5, which allowed quick access to/from the Royal Limo to whisk her off to/drop her from Windsor. (Platform 5 was the rear access to Slough and the Platform and Road was easy to secure). We would be advised by our supervisor when we signed on duty that the Royal Train was due to arrive/depart (time given) and that we were to remain at Slough PSB during the time that the Royal Train was within Slough PSB sphere of control, (except when ECS once the Queen had departed the Train, but not when it ran ECS to pick her up).

The PSB Signalmen would also be told when they booked on, and there would always be a Divisional Manager in the box to oversee that all protocols were followed. The Train would operate in a modified block working scenario. The signalman would replace each controlled signal passed back to Red until the Train had cleared the overlap of the next controlled signal. The Signalman would then be allowed to clear the previous signal, by setting the route up to the next controlled signal. This was especially relevant at Slough, as many of the Signals between the boundary between Reading/Slough PSB and Maidenhead had many Automatic Signals. The protocol was that the Reading Signalman would replace his last controlled signal to Red at Ruscombe after the passage of the Royal Train, and was not to set up the Route to the PSB's boundary until the Royal Train had passed Slough PSB first controlled signal's overlap, that the Signalman Block Belled "Train Out Of Section" (2-1). (There were Buttons in the Panel to allow Block working in emergencies). Also the Signalman at Slough would phone the Reading Signalman to confirm the above had been carried out before the Reading Signalman set up the route for the next Train.

Didn't always work. One Reading Signalman allowed the Reading to Paddington Stopper straight up behind the Royal Train one night. Suffice to say that the Divisional Manager in Slough PSB was not impressed and a 'Number One' was duly issued to the hapless Signaller.
 

jopsuk

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2008
Messages
12,773
Appears that they're not actually using the Royal Train today. Pictures I've seen seem to have SRPS or WCRC maroon coaches with one Pullman (Belmond?) coach for the VIP group.
 

infobleep

Veteran Member
Joined
27 Feb 2011
Messages
13,425
I was an S&T Tech at Slough during the '70's. The Royal Train would occasionally arrive or depart Slough, using Platform 5, which allowed quick access to/from the Royal Limo to whisk her off to/drop her from Windsor. (Platform 5 was the rear access to Slough and the Platform and Road was easy to secure). We would be advised by our supervisor when we signed on duty that the Royal Train was due to arrive/depart (time given) and that we were to remain at Slough PSB during the time that the Royal Train was within Slough PSB sphere of control, (except when ECS once the Queen had departed the Train, but not when it ran ECS to pick her up).

The PSB Signalmen would also be told when they booked on, and there would always be a Divisional Manager in the box to oversee that all protocols were followed. The Train would operate in a modified block working scenario. The signalman would replace each controlled signal passed back to Red until the Train had cleared the overlap of the next controlled signal. The Signalman would then be allowed to clear the previous signal, by setting the route up to the next controlled signal. This was especially relevant at Slough, as many of the Signals between the boundary between Reading/Slough PSB and Maidenhead had many Automatic Signals. The protocol was that the Reading Signalman would replace his last controlled signal to Red at Ruscombe after the passage of the Royal Train, and was not to set up the Route to the PSB's boundary until the Royal Train had passed Slough PSB first controlled signal's overlap, that the Signalman Block Belled "Train Out Of Section" (2-1). (There were Buttons in the Panel to allow Block working in emergencies). Also the Signalman at Slough would phone the Reading Signalman to confirm the above had been carried out before the Reading Signalman set up the route for the next Train.

Didn't always work. One Reading Signalman allowed the Reading to Paddington Stopper straight up behind the Royal Train one night. Suffice to say that the Divisional Manager in Slough PSB was not impressed and a 'Number One' was duly issued to the hapless Signaller.
Fascinating. Thanks for that. What is a number one?

How come the Queen didn't carry on to Windsor by royal train?
 

LeylandLen

Member
Joined
28 Oct 2013
Messages
779
Location
Leyland Lancs
And it is on RTT as 156A . Following it as well as coverage on BBC News Channel. It is not THE usual Royal Train Rolling stock as mentioned above . Running about 40 mins late due to Queens delayed departure from Balmoral by helicopter due to weather .
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
32,288
Location
Scotland
Appears that they're not actually using the Royal Train today. Pictures I've seen seem to have SRPS or WCRC maroon coaches with one Pullman (Belmond?) coach for the VIP group.
Surely any train carrying the Queen is the royal train, in much the same way that any US Air Force plane conveying the POTUS is Air Force 1?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top