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GN Class 717

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southern442

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samuelmorris said:
I agree it's not nice to be negative but all past evidence does suggest the likelihood of this introduction going without a hitch to be low...
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Of course things aren't going to be great when they first enter service. When was the last time a fleet was introduced without any hitches? I'm surprised we're even discussing it.
No doubt there will be the proud idiots who will gladly proclaim that the whole Desiro City project was a huge failure as soon as there's even a slight hint at some teething trouble...
 
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Failed Unit

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southern442 said:
Of course things aren't going to be great when they first enter service. When was the last time a fleet was introduced without any hitches? I'm surprised we're even discussing it.
No doubt there will be the proud idiots who will gladly proclaim that the whole Desiro City project was a huge failure as soon as there's even a slight hint at some teething trouble...
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When you look at all the classes. The 700 has just got above 10k miles per technical incident.

From modern railways

New Train TIN-watch
This month the good news is that both the Desiro City fleets topped 10,000 MTIN in Period 3 and the Great Western Hitachi Class 800 Intercity Express Trains (IET) were over 8,000 MTIN. However, as they say in the investment pages, MTIN Period figures can rise and fall, which is why MTIN MAA is what counts.
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The 707 better than the 700. I suspect the 717 will climb up the bathtub quicker with experience of both fleets.

However still a bit to go before they better the 313s.

Hopefully this time next year they will be in the 50k region.
 
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southern442

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Failed Unit said:
Hopefully this time next year they will be in the 50k region.
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I might be speaking too soon, but I reckon in a few years at least one of the classes will end up topping reliability tables. Would be a laughing shame if it was the 707's, unless they can find a home.
 
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Team Defect

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From what I've seen so far the 717 will definitely be unreliable to start with. There appears to be many issues with software and systems not always booting up correctly when the units are started up in the depot. It seems to be fairly common to have to trip and reset circuit breakers on some systems after the unit has booted up to get some of the systems to work. PIS and train data recorders seem to have this issue.

Having said that I agree that once the software glitches have been ironed out, following no doubt countless updates, they should start to become reliable units in a few years.
 
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A0wen

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Failed Unit said:
However still a bit to go before they better the 313s.
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Perhaps it would be worth dusting off some of the articles to see what the stock faults were on the 313s back in the late 70s - ones I recall reading about included Tripcock problems / failures, problems with the passenger controlled doors.

In fact one book I've read was drawing uncomplimentary comparisons between the 313s and the 30 year old Class 306s.....

For my money, the 717s will get up to standard much faster than the 313s did - in part due to the other Desiro classes having helped to iron out some of the other problems.
 
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samuelmorris

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southern442 said:
I might be speaking too soon, but I reckon in a few years at least one of the classes will end up topping reliability tables. Would be a laughing shame if it was the 707's, unless they can find a home.
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Given the other two top units (i.e. highest Siemens and highest Bombardier) are the 379s and 350/2s, the 707s would make it a hat trick!

I'm sure things will progressively improve as they always do, but it has taken the 700 over two years to reach the mediocre figure of 10k, I'm not sure the 717s are likely to outperform 313s until 2020 earliest.
 
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Fred26 said:
Yeah, it doesn't look right. Doesn't quite match the ambiance!
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It's a pity that they don't do a deep cleaning programme of the line and bring it up to date as that would have such a positive impact with the new trains, think London Overground effect when they take over routes in the past with new trains and a deep cleaning programme for all stations.
 
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jon0844

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Class 403 said:
It's a pity that they don't do a deep cleaning programme of the line and bring it up to date as that would have such a positive impact with the new trains, think London Overground effect when they take over routes in the past with new trains and a deep cleaning programme for all stations.
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If TfL is to take over the service for London Overground as widely predicted post management contract, it will almost certainly get done. And that will also likely prevent any work being done until then.
 
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387star

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The 313s are the Shabbiest externally on the network so fit with the run down NCL

Seems at odds with other services in the capital
 
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jon0844

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387star said:
The 313s are the Shabbiest externally on the network so fit with the run down NCL

Seems at odds with other services in the capital
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They've been well maintained and the interior and exterior used to be looked after, but now they're on the way out there's very little work being done as you might expect. Why waste the money when they're being scrapped (I can't imagine they won't be).
 
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Having seen a few photos of the interior of the new 717, presumably the one they ran the other day, the interior looks much like a 700. Which would be fine, but they also seem to have replicated the total lack of legroom for anyone over about 5'6".
 
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physics34

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OwenB said:
Having seen a few photos of the interior of the new 717, presumably the one they ran the other day, the interior looks much like a 700. Which would be fine, but they also seem to have replicated the total lack of legroom for anyone over about 5'6".
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Theyve had an age to sort this out, but with no one at the helm of GTR taking any lead (or basically not caring), and My Grayling himself not interested in running a railway, it seems no alterations to the spec have been done.
 
OwenB

OwenB

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physics34 said:
Theyve had an age to sort this out, but with no one at the helm of GTR taking any lead (or basically not caring), and My Grayling himself not interested in running a railway, it seems no alterations to the spec have been done.
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Honestly, even having fewer seats would be a better outcome than seats people can't sit in.
 
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