GN Class 717

[Failed Unit]

Well with regards to the seats they could always put the 3+2 seating in from the Class 313s and reuse them in the Class 717s... Save money etc...

Seriously though, nothing wrong with the seats as being 2+2 and having much more standing room the new Class 717s are a worthwhile replacement for the dinosaurs that are Class 313s.

I don’t think people mind about 2+2 seating. Just the design in the 7xx people hate. If they had decent padding no-one would mind. Hence why people like the 365s better. (Or rush to the declassified first on the 700s) But we have done this to death. Yes personal preference but the seats in the 387, 700 and 717s in many people’s views are too hard. The latest Orr surveys has see the views on seat comfort significantly decline on GN compared to 1 year ago.

 

[spark001uk]

Interesting how the preview workings are marked as first+standard on RTT. I would have thought once the traction is entered as 313 then it would autofill as standard only. Obviously it can be overridden, though quite why it has been I'm not sure?

 

[Failed Unit]

Was having a look yesterday at the position of the stop boards.

As Jon stated earlier the stop boards at WGC are at the extreme ends of the majority of platforms. Considering that the 717 will rarely go North it is odd. Let’s say you arrive at platform 1 (after coming from the flyover) Stop at the 717 board on a train that is returning south. The unit will be need to be moved south on the platform. However I could be missing something.

At Hadley wood the southbound fast line is on the unused part of the platform. So it will mean SDO. Again stopping trains rarely stop on the fast line so no big deal.

At new Southgate both in what I would consider a normal position.

Didn’t see any on on Southbound City line stations.

I think it will be a while yet before they are seen on real services. Don’t really see many on test either on the WGC line. Not saying it doesn’t happen. Just use to frequently see the 387s. But I guess when you are passing trains I could just assume I have passed a 700.

 

[jon0844]

717s have been going to WGC for months. Usually during the night. I believe they've done every possible route into and out of the platforms, to the reverse sidings, the carriage sidings and possibly via Digswell on platform 1 (going north). Then there have been many stops by 717s gaining mileage by going to Peterborough and then back, again with a stop.

I'd hope WGC is ready and waiting. I know some drivers who are keen to get going, as they like driving the 700s. I'd like to find out what they think of the tiny cab though!

 

[Failed Unit]

Probably why I have not seen them. The 387s when they were getting introduced were often sat on platform 1 at WGC, as were the 700s. But the slow line service is more intense now so makes sense to do the testing at night.

Likewise when you were passing units at speed in the opposite direction the new stock stood out more.

Apart from the NCL. I didn’t notice and stations without stop boards. (But that doesn’t mean that they don’t exist)

 

[Af317]

Today's 14:37 Moorgate - Gordon Hill is 717014

 

[daniel1234321]

014 on the 1437 service this afternoon

 

[dave4jackie]

when is the full service of 717s meant to happen

 

[Failed Unit]

when is the full service of 717s meant to happen

Nobody knows as that date has already passed.

 

[jon0844]

Nobody knows as that date has already passed.

A driver told me a date but I am not sure I dare post it! I can only hope the 717 out on Friday to WGC will have been to sign off, and could lead to services starting in a week or two. But I am starting to wonder if they'll ever run, and we'll be down to a mix of 3 car services and cancellations altogether due to a lack of serviceable trains.

(The only positive about 3 or more units out of use is that they'll be donating body parts to other trains, but when will there be time for Hornsey to do any of the work?)

 

[daniel1234321]

when is the full service of 717s meant to happen

According to a GTR employee on wnxx, all issues have been resolved now, just union approval and ORR sign off and they're good to go. GN website (greatnorthernrail.com/717trains) says February, so if everything goes well I'm estimating 25th Feb or 4th March. This should be service introduction on 2-5 diagrams, and I believe from the first ones being introduced, there will be 1 or 2 more diagrams converted to 717s every week until all the 313s are replaced.

 

[Failed Unit]

A driver told me a date but I am not sure I dare post it! I can only hope the 717 out on Friday to WGC will have been to sign off, and could lead to services starting in a week or two. But I am starting to wonder if they'll ever run, and we'll be down to a mix of 3 car services and cancellations altogether due to a lack of serviceable trains.

(The only positive about 3 or more units out of use is that they'll be donating body parts to other trains, but when will there be time for Hornsey to do any of the work?)

Have all stations got the stop boards yet? Haven’t see any at old street yet. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t there. Could be that I am looking in the wrong place.

Most appear to be in place above ground. Including some in surprising positions. (Hadley wood, southbound fast - rarely used so wont cause an issue)

The NCL ones will be harder to spot from a train then the ones that are above ground so very easy to miss.

 

[Downthelane]

What will we do with all the time we get back in our lives once the 313’s have gone!?

For example the 17.21 KGX to Cambridge won’t be slow between Potters Bar and Hatfield once the 313 ahead of it becomes a 717. So the 17.21 potentially arrives at Hatfield 1-2 minutes earlier, and so on.

 

[gm671]

Deleted

 

[Failed Unit]

Thanks. yep sounds like I was not likely to see if on the platform.

 

[Failed Unit]

What will we do with all the time we get back in our lives once the 313’s have gone!?

For example the 17.21 KGX to Cambridge won’t be slow between Potters Bar and Hatfield once the 313 ahead of it becomes a 717. So the 17.21 potentially arrives at Hatfield 1-2 minutes earlier, and so on.

Be interesting to see how that works. Going the other way late departures on the 0822 WGC - London Kx often delays the 0824 Moorgate. Will it recover? We will see as then this in turn often delays the 0832.

 

[rebmcr]

GTR have also gone for the cheap/quick option of NOT installing balises in numerous locations and using the GPS instead. This results in all platforms at that location using SDO rather than just the problem one. (Brookmans Park - issue is only on p4 but SDO5 will operate on all platforms.)

Will they gradually convert to balises once the trains are running, or will that have to wait for the fabled ETCS resignalling?

 

[jon0844]

Will they gradually convert to balises once the trains are running, or will that have to wait for the fabled ETCS resignalling?

Is there any issue using SDO with GPS? It's surely how the 700s do things at the moment for stations like Meldreth, or the 9xxx services that call at WGC in each direction once per day?

Brookmans Park with one coach locked out isn't going to be a massive issue in either direction. It won't be an issue from WGC as the trains won't be anywhere close to full by then, and coming back it won't be full either as people for Brookmans Park wouldn't want to be at the back and many people will have alighted at other stations beforehand.

 

[gm671]

Deleted

 

[Failed Unit]

Is there any issue using SDO with GPS? It's surely how the 700s do things at the moment for stations like Meldreth, or the 9xxx services that call at WGC in each direction once per day?

Brookmans Park with one coach locked out isn't going to be a massive issue in either direction. It won't be an issue from WGC as the trains won't be anywhere close to full by then, and coming back it won't be full either as people for Brookmans Park wouldn't want to be at the back and many people will have alighted at other stations beforehand.

No one will know to be honest for the reasons you state. I expect it will be the same as Hendon on mml. Most will be in the coach nearest steps (as they are now)

 

[332 > 444]

Same with Hornsey and Harringay on the 'Up' SDO5 boards have been put in place and this is only just recent.

 

[daniel1234321]

Unit 012 running the preview services today.

 

[387star]

Why have white ends?
Yellow isn't a requirement but surely they would go for something colourful

 

[jon0844]

Why have white ends?
Yellow isn't a requirement but surely they would go for something colourful

It's light grey and black. Doesn't look too bad and the lights can seen from space, so you're not missing it.

 

[daniel1234321]

014 on the 5G90 2158 Hornsey Depot to Letchworth, while 021 is on the 5J41 2021 Ferme Park to Ferme Park.

 

[daniel1234321]

012 on the previews today.

 

[Jack Timbrell]

012 on the previews today.

Does the same unit operate all the preview services that day? Or are they changing them around?

 

[daniel1234321]

Does the same unit operate all the preview services that day? Or are they changing them around?

Yes, the same unit runs preview services all day, as it never returns to Hornsey EMUD until it is done operating all the preview services for that day.

 

[daniel1234321]

012 again ran the previews today.

 

[Arkady]

Signal failure on the NCL and/or a broken down train and/or shortage of drivers (all three excuses have been announced) has knackered the Moorgate service. Curiously 717002 just left Finsbury Park fast to Welwyn... was it scheduled or was it deployed early on a rescue mission?