Bridge Strikes

[Tomnick]

This is a silly question but i am curious. What counts as a bridge strike - or more specifically, what counts as a strike that requires reporting?

If i reversed into a bridge or other railway structure at <5mph in a car, or rode a motorbike/bicycle into it at high speed (lets ignore human injury in this scenario), what would count (if any) as "too slow" to be of any real concern?

One of the documents I read (might be the one linked above) says that strikes involving cars (and I assume motorbikes) don't need to be reported to Network Rail. Strikes involving larger vehicles - especially if it hits the bridge deck - do need to be reported no matter what the speed.

Cars, motorbikes or small vans don't need reporting, unless there is obvious damage.
Anything over and including a Transit size needs reporting, and it doesn't matter where they hit the bridge, so does include side walls.
Bridges over the railway, then anything hitting the sides should be reported.

I'd be interested to see anywhere that this is written down (I haven't had chance to look at the link referred to by najaB). The fact that our 'bridge strike appendix' (not sure whether it's the same for all regions) specifically lists certain (many, but not all) bridges as having 'light vehicle dispensation' - for collisions involving vehicles such as those listed above - implies that the railway expects to receive reports from such incidents, and that some of those reports require action the same as any other bridge strike. I'd always understood that the definition was left deliberately vague so that the judgment of the person witnessing the bridge strike wouldn't be influenced in any way - better to get the report when it's not required (and then work out whether the dispensation applies) than to have a serious bridge strike go unreported.

 

[455driver]

It's the difference between being a professional and displaying professionalism.

Thank you, that's what I was trying to say but couldn't think if the words.

It's like people saying their workmates when they actually mean the people they work with, while they are all people you work with they are not all workmates!

 

[Chris M]

Regarding rental vehicles, I recently hired a high-roof transit-type van and while it wasn't tall enough to worry about any of the bridges I needed to travel under the height information was not printed anywhere within the drivers vision - it was on the back wall of the cab and impossible to see when sat in the driving seat. If this is the case for other rental vehicles I can quite understand if they hit bridges, particularly if the driver is familiar with the route in a lower vehicle.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Regarding rental vehicles, I recently hired a high-roof transit-type van and while it wasn't tall enough to worry about any of the bridges I needed to travel under the height information was not printed anywhere within the drivers vision - it was on the back wall of the cab and impossible to see when sat in the driving seat. If this is the case for other rental vehicles I can quite understand if they hit bridges, particularly if the driver is familiar with the route in a lower vehicle.

Im not absolutely certain here without checking, but I think it may only be a legal requirement to display such information in the cab of 7.5 tonne (MGV) and upwards type vehicles.

Edit: disregard the above, it seems any vehicle with a height of 3 metres or more should have it displayed in a position clearly seen by the driver,

In the 7.5 tonne and above vehicles I drove for Royal Mail it was always clearly displayed on the forward bulkhead above either the drivers or assistants seat.

 

[GB]

Regarding rental vehicles, I recently hired a high-roof transit-type van and while it wasn't tall enough to worry about any of the bridges I needed to travel under the height information was not printed anywhere within the drivers vision - it was on the back wall of the cab and impossible to see when sat in the driving seat. If this is the case for other rental vehicles I can quite understand if they hit bridges, particularly if the driver is familiar with the route in a lower vehicle.

Regardless of where the sign is printed or whether or not there is a sign in the first place, it doesn't absolve the driver of their responsibility to find out what the height is before setting off.

 

[richw]

Regarding rental vehicles, I recently hired a high-roof transit-type van and while it wasn't tall enough to worry about any of the bridges I needed to travel under the height information was not printed anywhere within the drivers vision - it was on the back wall of the cab and impossible to see when sat in the driving seat. If this is the case for other rental vehicles I can quite understand if they hit bridges, particularly if the driver is familiar with the route in a lower vehicle.

All of the transits high top and normal height have had the height and dimensions on the sun visor. One hire company I assume get a load of speeding tickets as they had a speed limit guide on the dash. Transits being over 2 tonne have lower speed limits than cars.

 

[CharlieSpotted]

Bridge strike at Tulse Hill today, via @internetben on twitter:

https://twitter.com/InternetBen/status/641549345918197760

Notable that this one of the bridges at the top of NR's list. What more can be done to protect it?

 

[Ash Bridge]

Bridge strike at Tulse Hill today, via @internetben on twitter:

https://twitter.com/InternetBen/status/641549345918197760

Notable that this one of the bridges at the top of NR's list. What more can be done to protect it?

Address the cause,

Employ professional drivers with a professional attitude!

 

[najaB]

Address the cause,

Employ professional drivers with a professional attitude!

Especially as the high restriction sign is one of the nice round YOU SHALL NOT type.

 

[crispy1978]

Perhaps a daft question, but is it the height which generally causes the problem, or does a vehicle hitting the bottom/side of the bridge cause problems too? For example, a crash involving a car crashing in to the wall, etc?

 

[Antman]

Address the cause,

Employ professional drivers with a professional attitude!

Or employ somebody who never makes a mistake? Do you know any such people?

 

[blotred]

Why can't a metal bar or rope be placed at the height of the bridge a couple of metres before the bridge?
Truck strikes the bar/rope and saves the bridge?

I think they do that in Japan.

 

[Domh245]

Apparently, there has been an incident involving a double decker bus and a bridge in Rotherham Rochdale that just popped up on the news.

 

[Antman]

Apparently, there has been an incident involving a double decker bus and a bridge in Rotherham that just popped up on the news.

The report I heard said it was in Rochdale, 22 people injured

 

[Saint66]

Apparently, there has been an incident involving a double decker bus and a bridge in Rotherham that just popped up on the news.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...news/dozens-injured-roof-torn-double-10019861

 

[Ash Bridge]

Or employ somebody who never makes a mistake? Do you know any such people?

No, but there are different types of mistakes, such as minor errors of judgement, then there are serious mistakes, so what category would you put a bridge strike in?

 

[CharlieSpotted]

The report I heard said it was in Rochdale, 22 people injured

Oh dear, I do hope those people are OK.

Whenever this happens, you have to wonder whether the problem is caused by the drivers sometimes driving single and sometimes double-deck vehicles, and simply forgetting which type they're driving on that day? Because, let's face it, you just wouldn't take a risk like that with a busload of passengers. Surely.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

No, but there are different types of mistakes, such as minor errors of judgement, then there are serious mistakes, so what category would you put a bridge strike in?

Quite. People make mistakes - this I understand.

When I make a minor mistake at work I can usually correct it myself, or my colleagues help me out and we can mitigate it. But if I was to make a major mistake then I would expect there to be consequences. To me, a bridge bash in a HGV is a major mistake, and it should have consequences for the driver responsible.

 

[Antman]

No, but there are different types of mistakes, such as minor errors of judgement, then there are serious mistakes, so what category would you put a bridge strike in?

That is an irrelevant question, I can't imagine anybody drives into a low bridge for the fun of it

 

[GB]

That's an irrelevant point. I'm sure 99% of accidents haven't been for the fun of it...doesn't mean whoever caused it shouldn't be penalised for it.

The level of culpability and level of punishment is debatable though.

 

[Antman]

That's an irrelevant point. I'm sure 99% of accidents haven't been for the fun of it...doesn't mean whoever caused it shouldn't be penalised for it.

The level of culpability and level of punishment is debatable though.

The point is, how do we stop these bridge strikes from happening?

 

[455driver]

Or employ somebody who never makes a mistake? Do you know any such people?

I am already employed, sorry!



Note-
This is not meant to be taken seriously!

 

[LeylandLen]

Here is BBC item ...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-34198572

A double-decker bus has crashed into a railway bridge in Rochdale, shearing off the roof and injuring 17 people.

The incident happened on Milkstone Road shortly before 12:30 BST. Fourteen ambulances were sent to the scene.

One man in his 20s suffered a broken jaw and a woman was taken to hospital with serious facial injuries.

Twenty-five people were on board and managed to get off the vehicle, which was not on its usual route.

Paramedics treated passengers at the scene...

 

[455driver]

Why can't a metal bar or rope be placed at the height of the bridge a couple of metres before the bridge?
Truck strikes the bar/rope and saves the bridge?

I think they do that in Japan.

At which point the bar falls down and rips the roof off a car going in the opposite direction killing the driver and front seat passenger!
Who gets the blame?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

At which point the bar falls down and rips the roof off a car going in the opposite direction killing the driver and front seat passenger!
Who gets the blame?

I assume that's one of the reasons this method isn't generally employed in this country. The infra-red overheight detectors coupled with a large dot-matrix sign which illuminates when a large vehicle passes seem to be more common, but presumably they cost a fair bit more, and aren't suitable for every location.

With incidents involving buses, presumably these only occur when a bus goes off-route (either as a result of diversions or driver error) or when a double decker is allocated to a route which should be single only. In the latter case, the bus company should be held partially responsible. The earlier incident from today involved a container which obviously is not always on the back of said wagon, so any height indicator in the cab wouldn't necessarily include the height of the container although it obviously should do so.

 

[jopsuk]

I saw pictures from elsewhere today of a double decker that had gone open top- obviously the stats say there's likely been other incidents.

 

[najaB]

In the BBC report linked above it says the bus was off-route. This is a common cause of this type of accident. You have to wonder though what was the thought process that lead to the driver ignoring/not seeing the clearly posted 12' 6" height restriction sign and driving a double-decker through and into the bridge.

Is the sign perhaps too high - if you're looking at the sign you aren't looking at the bridge and vice versa?

 

[jopsuk]

some pictures of the approaches to the bridge at Tulse Hill

 

[Waddon]

Surely with modern satnav technology, some kind of alert system could be fitted inside double decker buses that gives an audible warning if the driver is approaching a low bridge? Could be fitted to HGV's too, I'm sure the insurance companies would love it

Dragon's Den, here I come!

 

[paddydick]

I think this the third time this bridge has been hit in almost as many months

 

[ChiefPlanner]

some pictures of the approaches to the bridge at Tulse Hill

A car transporter hit it last week ! - real issue this one - it could have been much , much worse as it knocked out the Tulse Hill - London Bridge and the Herne Hill TLK routes. (for a mercifully modest time) - good effort by NR Mobile Ops Managers and Bridge Examiners to give the lines back to traffic.

About 6 or so bridge strikes a day UK wise.....pain in the proverbial.