ScotRail HST Introduction - Updates & Discussion

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Steven_G

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Seems like the HST diagrams will be refurbs solely from now.

Maybe add another 5/6 diagrams in May, odd classic if they are short for a month or so.

170’s being freed up

Getting there
 

hexagon789

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Seems like the HST diagrams will be refurbs solely from now.

Maybe add another 5/6 diagrams in May, odd classic if they are short for a month or so.

170’s being freed up

Getting there
I can't remember when the Classics dispensation runs out, but I have a feeling it was sooner than December, could be wrong.
 

47271

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Seems like the HST diagrams will be refurbs solely from now.

Maybe add another 5/6 diagrams in May, odd classic if they are short for a month or so.

170’s being freed up

Getting there
There was a classic on the 1333 Edinburgh-Inverness yesterday.

So do you mean that was probably my last ever trip on one? I won't shed a tear if it was!
 

Speed43125

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There was a classic on the 1333 Edinburgh-Inverness yesterday.

So do you mean that was probably my last ever trip on one? I won't shed a tear if it was!
No, seen at least one running on the HML via Stirling today. Seem to if anything have picked up in number out of GLQ, so perhaps they are gone from Edinburgh?
 
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hexagon789

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It's an assumption as a couple of times it's been mentioned here no classics had been out and the diagrams solely refurbs.

Perhaps just not consistently
A case of if they can run all Refurbs they will, but the Classics are the back-up cover, which is why they are seen more infrequently of late?
 

DannyMich2018

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A case of if they can run all Refurbs they will, but the Classics are the back-up cover, which is why they are seen more infrequently of late?
Yes pretty much right, according to the latest issue of Today's Railway's UK the "use of these is to be kept to a minimum" cause of course these are non PRM compliant and discharge waste onto the tracks so they'll only use them when needed and now with 12 sets delivered and maybe a 13th tomorrow things have really picked up now, that be 3 delivered in 2020, with work on XC or GW HST fleet nearing completion this has allowed a speed up in work.
 

hexagon789

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Yes pretty much right, according to the latest issue of Today's Railway's UK the "use of these is to be kept to a minimum" cause of course these are non PRM compliant and discharge waste onto the tracks so they'll only use them when needed and now with 12 sets delivered and maybe a 13th tomorrow things have really picked up now, that be 3 delivered in 2020, with work on XC or GW HST fleet nearing completion this has allowed a speed up in work.
Indeed, a potential ramp-up of the delivery rate was suggested due to the completion of the GWR/XC fleet. If that's the case then we may well see the conclusion of this project by the end of the year.

The only other things to be seen are the illusive 5th trailers...
 

Speed43125

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Indeed, a potential ramp-up of the delivery rate was suggested due to the completion of the GWR/XC fleet. If that's the case then we may well see the conclusion of this project by the end of the year.

The only other things to be seen are the illusive 5th trailers...
We still hoping to get all sets increased to 5 car?
 

Clansman

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We still hoping to get all sets increased to 5 car?
Yep.

It's unsustainable from a capacity viewpoint for 4 car sets to still exist in the next for years. ScotRail have grossly underestimated how much capacity they actually need on the HSTs, and it will only get worse of nothing changes.
 

Speed43125

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Yep.

It's unsustainable from a capacity viewpoint for 4 car sets to still exist in the next for years. ScotRail have grossly underestimated how much capacity they actually need on the HSTs, and it will only get worse of nothing changes.
How much are we anticipating demand to increase? I've just seen a 2-car 158 running up north from Glasgow, admittedly, this was after the Dunblane (and more importantly Stirling) stop(s), but it was at best 50% loaded. is the full introduction of HSTs anticipated to greatly increase the demand for travel? Because outside of peak times on weekdays, the HSTs I've seen are not very full, especially in 1st class.
 

hexagon789

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We still hoping to get all sets increased to 5 car?
I'm sure all of us are hoping that will prove to be the case, but the last official announcement on the subject of extending all the HSTs to 2+5 was the tweet by ScotRail to say they were pursuing this course with Angel Trains.

I've seen nothing since then to confirm or refute that. I think all of us would agree that in terms of capacity it's needed, all the sets should be made up to 5-car as soon as possible after delivery and ideally they would use TGS vehicles to address the cycle space issue.
 

hexagon789

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How much are we anticipating demand to increase? I've just seen a 2-car 158 running up north from Glasgow, admittedly, this was after the Dunblane (and more importantly Stirling) stop(s), but it was at best 50% loaded. is the full introduction of HSTs anticipated to greatly increase the demand for travel? Because outside of peak times on weekdays, the HSTs I've seen are not very full, especially in 1st class.
A two-car 158 can get stupidly full in the summer months on the HML, 5-car is the way to go. If there are empty seats off-peak, off-season then that's up to ScotRail to offer some well-priced advances to attract custom to full them.
 
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57312 taking 4 coaches from ely to Doncaster today (1 GWR and 3 FGW) for refurbishment, just seen it go past Doncaster webcam

There is another Doncaster to haymarket move on friday, maybe incase today's move doesnt run
 

leightonbd

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I agree that the situation is ridiculous, but what's worse, passengers turning up thinking they've got a reservation and finding they don't, or passengers knowing they don't right from the start? Probably the first of those two, and that's what we've had for the past year. That it's taken them this long even to acknowledge the problem speaks volumes for management competence and attitudes towards the passenger.
Does ‘no reservations’ remain the case?

I booked two returns to Aberdeen with Scotrail this morning, ticked the box for seat reservations, but in my email confirmation is the horrendous botch: ‘The passenger is free to sit in any vacant unreserved seat for the class of travel specified on the ticket’.

When is a reservation not a reservation! At least we are travelling from the origin both ways.
 

Jamesrob637

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A two-car 158 can get stupidly full in the summer months on the HML, 5-car is the way to go. If there are empty seats off-peak, off-season then that's up to ScotRail to offer some well-priced advances to attract custom to full them.
If I can be guaranteed a 5-car (and some nice weather!) I might make a trip up this summer.
 

hexagon789

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If I can be guaranteed a 5-car (and some nice weather!) I might make a trip up this summer.
I doubt it will be this summer. I see it as December 2020 - planned all refurbs in service THEN extending to 5-cars. I doubt we'll see any 2+5 sets until after all the sets are in traffic.
 

47271

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Does ‘no reservations’ remain the case?

I booked two returns to Aberdeen with Scotrail this morning, ticked the box for seat reservations, but in my email confirmation is the horrendous botch: ‘The passenger is free to sit in any vacant unreserved seat for the class of travel specified on the ticket’.

When is a reservation not a reservation! At least we are travelling from the origin both ways.
There are no reservations because they still have no reliable idea on what type of stock will run at any given moment. If you're boarding at the origin, just get on the train quick and you'll be fine. Survival of the fittest.
 

hexagon789

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A 3 car 170 can get stupidly full in the summer, particularly on the 1250 INV-EDB which is a notoriously busy service - i've seen it full and standing from Aviemore.
I don't doubt that either, the reference earlier was to 158s. Even double 158s have been known to full up with tourists, commuters and locals when the timing is right, I would hope one thing we can all agree with in this thread is that more seats are always welcome ;)
 

47271

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I don't doubt that either, the reference earlier was to 158s. Even double 158s have been known to full up with tourists, commuters and locals when the timing is right, I would hope one thing we can all agree with in this thread is that more seats are always welcome ;)
The 1333 Edinburgh-Inverness last Friday, a classic HST, was very full south of Perth. It was absolutely rammed north of Perth, with people standing all the way down the aisles.

We're woefully short of capacity at the peak with just about anything at the moment. Five coach HSTs can't come a moment too soon.
 

Northhighland

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It is common for people to stand on HML services. That isn’t acceptable given the distances involved. How many don’t even try the train because of the overcrowding?

HML needs extra capacity.
 

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