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ScotRail HST Introduction - Updates & Discussion

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hexagon789

hexagon789

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ScotRail have published a cab view video of the most recently delivered set, travelling from Newcastle to Haymarket, on their YouTube channel.
 
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Roger B

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I went to Edinburgh from Manchester on a TPE £1 each way deal on Monday, and saw a few HSTs, all in the Inter7City livery, other than one still in FGW livery. What did surprise me was the number of power cars sat on Haymarket depot. I saw at least 9 there, including 43037, 43147, 43127, 43149, 43143, 43124 and 43182.
 
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St. Paddy

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Roger B said:
I went to Edinburgh from Manchester on a TPE £1 each way deal on Monday, and saw a few HSTs, all in the Inter7City livery, other than one still in FGW livery. What did surprise me was the number of power cars sat on Haymarket depot. I saw at least 9 there, including 43037, 43147, 43127, 43149, 43143, 43124 and 43182.
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There will eventually be 26 Inter7City sets and for this, you need 52 power cars plus a handful of spares. As only 13 have been delivered so far and only about 5 classic sets remain, there’s no work for these power cars until more arrive although I’m sure they rotate them to keep them operational
 
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Roger B said:
What did surprise me was the number of power cars sat on Haymarket depot. I saw at least 9 there, including 43037, 43147, 43127, 43149, 43143, 43124 and 43182.
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St. Paddy said:
There will eventually be 26 Inter7City sets and for this, you need 52 power cars plus a handful of spares. As only 13 have been delivered so far and only about 5 classic sets remain, there’s no work for these power cars until more arrive although I’m sure they rotate them to keep them operational
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Plus they've got to replace all the ATP speedos so they're probably still working on that.
 
43096

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scotraildriver said:
Why? It wasnt part of the specification as at the time it wasn't known that the ATP speedo was going to be troublesome.
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Which just shows ScotRail’s lack of HST knowledge. For those with HST engineering knowledge the ATP speedo was always going to be a reliability problem.
 
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scotraildriver

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43096 said:
Which just shows ScotRail’s lack of HST knowledge. For those with HST engineering knowledge the ATP speedo was always going to be a reliability problem.
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Why were Scotrail not made aware of this then I wonder? Given that they haven't ever operated HSTs clearly the engineering knowledge will be poorer to start with and experience gleaned from elsewhere. Knowledge comes with experience, the maintenance of our fleets is generally excellent. There's not much depot staff don't know about 170s etc.
 
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Northhighland

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scotraildriver said:
Why were Scotrail not made aware of this then I wonder? Given that they haven't ever operated HSTs clearly the engineering knowledge will be poorer to start with and experience gleaned from elsewhere. Knowledge comes with experience, the maintenance of our fleets is generally excellent. There's not much depot staff don't know about 170s etc.
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Completely agree with this and have posted on this topic earlier in the thread. I am a regular user of the HML and can honestly say in the last 15 years have rarely ever experienced a break down of the rolling stock.

The 170 / 158 fleets are well maintained. The teams doing so obviously know what they are doing. The struggles with the HST fleet could have been lessened with better project planning.

The speedo issue is obviously something that could and should have been sorted at Brush.
 
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PG

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scotraildriver said:
Why were Scotrail not made aware of this then I wonder? Given that they haven't ever operated HSTs clearly the engineering knowledge will be poorer to start with and experience gleaned from elsewhere. Knowledge comes with experience, the maintenance of our fleets is generally excellent. There's not much depot staff don't know about 170s etc.
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Are we certain that they weren't made aware? Or perhaps (more likely) the right people weren't made aware!

It's entirely possible that it was flagged up as an issue but was value engineered out of the power car refurbishment...
 
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gingertom

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PG said:
Are we certain that they weren't made aware? Or perhaps (more likely) the right people weren't made aware!

It's entirely possible that it was flagged up as an issue but was value engineered out of the power car refurbishment...
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ISTR upthread someone "in the know" did say something about it being taken out of the power car refurb spec having originally been in. With hindsight, I think that decision, 99.9% likely by a bean counter seeing it as a non-essential item on the balance sheet, may be regretted. However, most of the bean counters I've come across in my don't understand any such technical things- any attempt to explain is met with the suggestion of trying to pull the wool over their eyes so out it comes, only for it to bite them in the derriere later, as here. Frustrating.
 
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John Bishop

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But it’s not really been a problem has it? Apart from a few issues in service with the ATP speedos, given the huge surplus of power cars lying around, they can get them all replaced before all the sets arrive and are required in service.

All the sets I’ve seen in service have had them replaced, so it seems they are keeping pace on the replacement regime.

Can Scotrail do it cheaper than Brush? I’ve no idea.
 
43096

43096

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gingertom said:
ISTR upthread someone "in the know" did say something about it being taken out of the power car refurb spec having originally been in. With hindsight, I think that decision, 99.9% likely by a bean counter seeing it as a non-essential item on the balance sheet, may be regretted. However, most of the bean counters I've come across in my don't understand any such technical things- any attempt to explain is met with the suggestion of trying to pull the wool over their eyes so out it comes, only for it to bite them in the derriere later, as here. Frustrating.
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The original spec had the ATP kit as being isolated but not removed. The major item that was de-scoped from the original spec was the electronics upgrade (which all TOCs except GWR have done) despite it having a good cost:benefit as it includes new WSP electronics that significantly extend bogie and wheelset life.

If your attitude towards "bean counters" in real life was anything like that displayed in your post, I'm not surprised they didn't believe you. If you can't get a non-technical person to understand, maybe the issue was the way you explained it?
 
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Brissle Girl

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And the cost of it would appear on the P&L Account, not the Balance Sheet. So obviously you understand the bean counters expertise as little as you think they understand yours.
 
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