TransPennine Express North Route, New Timetable

[nr758123]

If they do split the stopper, there's going to be a pr exercise required, as direct Leeds services was one of the alleged benefits of the skip-stop pattern West of Huddersfield.

One of the few benefits, along with reduced journey times into Leeds and Manchester which have generally not been achieved because of lateness and cancellations.

That said, it was also said that in the event of the train that was supposed to stop being cancelled the next tpe service to pass through would call instead, which doesn't seem to have happened.

Quite so. Turned out what they meant was that if they cancel two services in a row (i.e. create a three hour gap) they will consider putting in a stop order. Not exactly what they said beforehand.

There were also things TPE chose not to mention before the timetable change, such as terminating/starting trains at Stalybridge if they are running more than about 10 minutes late and (as happened yesterday afternoon) putting on a replacement bus after two cancellations in a row.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I sure I once heard only a 153 or 2 car Pacer can use platform 5. If that is the case Network Rail should do something about it ahead of Northern releasing their 142s and 153s.

The longest unit it fits is a 2-car 150, and only just, as I said in my post. It's been a few years since I've seen a 150 in there though, so it may have been tightened up on account of how snugly they fit.

 

[ajdunlop]

This morning there is no overhead line power between Manchester Airport and Piccadilly. The list of ticket acceptance shows just how fragile the timetable is and how far the delay contagion can spread:
“
Some TransPennine Express services will terminate/start at Manchester Piccadilly or Manchester Victoria.
Customers can travel on Metrolink services between Manchester Airport and Manchester City Zone in both directions until further notice.
Ticket acceptance is in place with:
Northern on any reasonable route.
Virgin Trains between Preston and Edinburgh/Glasgow Central.
LNER between York and Newcastle in both directions.
CrossCountry between Leeds and Newcastle in both directions.
Grand Central between York and Northallerton in both directions.
East Midlands Trains between Manchester Piccadilly and Sheffield in both directions.
“

 

[pdq]

The scheme is live today, but it's glitchy (or not tested/proofread).
https://www.tpexpress.co.uk/help/may-timetable-compensation then links to https://compensation.tpexpress.co.uk/ where one enters season ticket and journey details.
However... some TPE stations (ie where they call) are not listed, Batley being mine. No problem, the page reads

If your station is not listed, or you require any further information or assistance, please contact our dedicated team via email at [email protected] or by phone on 0345 600 1671 (option 1) Mon to Fri 08:00 to 20:00​

That phone number, with option one, just quotes the NRE number then hangs up. The email address bounces back! I used the phone number again and navigated the options to get through to customer relations. No dedicated team, and they didn't seem aware of this special scheme. They did give me another email address which has at least logged the call with a reference - [email protected].

Screenshot_20171006-224914

• pdq
• 6 Oct 2017

Screenshot of forum on Chrome

Will see what happens next.

This gets better (or worse)...
Had an email from Customer Services this morning regretting that my WYPTE card is 'heavily discounted' and, as per the passengers charter, is not eligible to receive compensation for delays.
I have simply replied with this screenshot from https://www.tpexpress.co.uk/help/may-timetable-compensation, pointing out that this scheme explicitly includes Metro Cards.

 

[Kite159]

The longest unit it fits is a 2-car 150, and only just, as I said in my post. It's been a few years since I've seen a 150 in there though, so it may have been tightened up on account of how snugly they fit.

Very tight fit indeed (picture taken back in February), not a lot of space between the front of the unit and the pole.

 

[Jonny]

This morning there is no overhead line power between Manchester Airport and Piccadilly. The list of ticket acceptance shows just how fragile the timetable is and how far the delay contagion can spread:

Last Friday (24 Aug) there were a lot of stops skipped on the 16:15 ex Newcastle due to a late incoming service. Not much good if you were planning to use it to Chester-le-Street.
(RTT link here and backup). It still managed to end up cancelled further along as well!

 

[yorksrob]

Very tight fit indeed (picture taken back in February), not a lot of space between the front of the unit and the pole.

"In the platform, the quiet platform, the Sprinter sleeps tonight"

 

[Jamesrob637]

"In the platform, the quiet platform, the Sprinter sleeps tonight"

Don't often post in here but that's a classic! Or in a year or so:
"In the scrap yard, the mighty scrap yard, the Pacer rusts away"

However I appreciate I digress a little!

 

[yorksrob]

Don't often post in here but that's a classic! Or in a year or so:
"In the scrap yard, the mighty scrap yard, the Pacer rusts away"

However I appreciate I digress a little!

Well, he did say it was a "tight fit"

 

[Starmill]

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/new...ate-claims-under-fire-rail-operator-1-9334214

A new policy to cut the number of late-running trains on the flagship East Coast Main Line route has had the knock-on effect of causing further disruption and delays for other rail users in Yorkshire, it is claimed.

A very garbled article indeed.

 

[FQTV]

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/new...ate-claims-under-fire-rail-operator-1-9334214



A very garbled article indeed.

I actually thought that it read quite well...

There's no doubt that the Castlefield Corridor is unworkable as-is, that Piccadilly is woefully provisioned and the Northern Timetable recast was critically-flawed and had severe knock-ons, and staff shortages at both Northern and TPE are ongoing, but I have said it before on this forum that there's apparently something else (or somethings else) going on that's affecting TPE's performance North and East of York.

In other threads posters have been questioning why services are being put into platforms at places like Sheffield and Huddersfield where they inevitably become blocks; why services aren't being looped etc., etc.

This is the first time that I have read anything that 'officially' supports my hunch, however.

Ironically, if what the TPE letter suggests is true, then this is arguably a major risk in Privatisation v71 or whichever review we're staring at now, with vertically-integrated regions and (say) LNER being the dominant controller of all traffic on the ECML, but no BRB to make everyone play nice.

 

[northernchris]

It doesn't make sense. Network Rail say priority is given to on time trains, regardless of operator, however from my own experiences this isn't true. The York and Selby services from Leeds are frequently held to allow late TPE services to leave, my record is 4 with a 20 minute delay to the stopper despite it being in on time. The irony is this then held up a later TPE which was on time, so the number of late trains increased from 4 to 6.

 

[Kieran1990]

Interesting sight this evening
17:17 Picc-Leeds was swung into the loop at Diggle to allow the 17:17 (15L) Man Vic-Middlesbrough & 1731 Man Vic- Scarborough to pass it, think this the first time I’ve seen the loop used.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Wish id caught that and got the red pen out.

 

[Kieran1990]

Wish id caught that and got the red pen out.

Couldn’t quiet believe it myself- sadly I was sat on the other side by the window and couldn’t snap a photo. I had suspected it was after we had started crawling from Greenfield.
Personally it should be used more often to allow the Scarborough to overtake the stopper which is always late but I don’t make these decisions but I hope they resolve the North TPE wowes

 

[YorkshireBear]

The problem with Diggle (and in some ways Marsden and Dewsbury) is that the signalling is not set up for it to happen regularly. So it takes forever, with a crawl behind as the trains are slow on the approach without a route out the other end of the loop. Mirfield in the other direction is much better mainly due to the length of the loop but also because trains can enter the 'Loop'on greens.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

The problem with Diggle (and in some ways Marsden and Dewsbury) is that the signalling is not set up for it to happen regularly. So it takes forever, with a crawl behind as the trains are slow on the approach without a route out the other end of the loop. Mirfield in the other direction is much better mainly due to the length of the loop but also because trains can enter the 'Loop'on greens.

One issue I've noticed a few times at Mirfield (and it's presumably a scheduling issue rather than an infrastructure one) is how often the westbound stopper passes Ravensthorpe as the same time as the Wakefield to Huddersfield service. Cue a few moments of parallel running, which is quite rare up here, before the Wakefield has to brake for the red allowing the TPE into Mirfield P3 first! Then Mirfield gets the two Huddersfield services within 3mins of each other, rather than the 5mins interval on the timetable.

 

[DJH1971]

Not sure if this has been mentioned on here and apologies if it has.

This is regarding TransPennine Express services between Liverpool and the North East that stop at Lea Green.

I was involved in a discussion on Facebook today regarding the state of the station car park.

Since the May timetable when TPE started serving Lea Green whilst St Helens Junction saw a reduction in services calling there, there has been quite a number of difficulties will rail passengers trying to park at Lea Green to the point they were parking illegally as well as blocking other cars in. Hardly a surprise as more rail users are clamouring to catch the TPE trains, plus Lea Green is right next to a school.

I took a picture of such an incident yesterday and posted on Facebook.

One of the responses I had was from someone who said he works for TPE and that he has heard that from the December 2018 timetable, TPE will be stopping at St Helens Junction instead due to the car park being recently enlarged.

Does anyone else know more about this?

 

[bbrez]

Transpennine confirmed on their Twitter that the stopper will be split. Definitely the right decision.

https://twitter.com/TPEassist/status/1045214945103818752

 

[geoffk]

Not sure if this has been mentioned on here and apologies if it has.

This is regarding TransPennine Express services between Liverpool and the North East that stop at Lea Green.

Since the May timetable when TPE started serving Lea Green whilst St Helens Junction saw a reduction in services calling there, there has been quite a number of difficulties will rail passengers trying to park at Lea Green to the point they were parking illegally as well as blocking other cars in. Hardly a surprise as more rail users are clamouring to catch the TPE trains, plus Lea Green is right next to a school.

One of the responses I had was from someone who said he works for TPE and that he has heard that from the December 2018 timetable, TPE will be stopping at St Helens Junction instead due to the car park being recently enlarged.

Does anyone else know more about this?

Seems the parking problems at St. Helens Junction have just been transferred to Lea Green. Another issue is platform length at Lea Green (and Newton-le-Willows) as the new stock has five cars. St. Helens Jn would a better bet if the car park has been enlarged (and there's also a cafe!)

 

[swt_passenger]

Transpennine confirmed on their Twitter that the stopper will be split. Definitely the right decision.

https://twitter.com/TPEassist/status/1045214945103818752

Far more detail was given here last week when it was first confirmed:
https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...-contagion-spreads.166907/page-6#post-3645138

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Transpennine confirmed on their Twitter that the stopper will be split. Definitely the right decision.

https://twitter.com/TPEassist/status/1045214945103818752

Love how the first reply is moaning about Slaithwaite losing the direct Leeds services... not saying that isn't an inconvenience but Twitter does bring out the negatives doesn't it? Surely a more reliable service with a change is better than a direct train that never shows up while several identical trains whizz through with no sign of the promised stop orders being given... I do note that the TPE Twitter operative doesn't explain that this should make the service more reliable. Surely the first thing to do is explain why a change is being made?

 

[pdq]

This is bad news for me travelling from Batley to Huddersfield. The service seemed to have settled down recently: the 0749 BTL - HUD has been pretty much on time for a while, and my usual 1722 HUD - BTL hasn't been too bad (generally 5 - 10 mins late but I just leave work later so it's effectively a 1730 service...)

Prior to May the connection times at Dewsbury heading west were as good as they could be - around 5 mins between the BTL - MCV and the DEW - HUD. Now there's going to be a 14 minute wait. The timings of the directs just don't work for me and my work pattern. Returning it's the same story - long wait at DEW off the 1722 HUD-HUL.

Finally, it seems very odd that TPE are keeping the LDS to HUD portion - it's neither transpennine nor express...

Do people reckon these changes in December are temporary until the new trains and infrastructure allows this year's May timetable to be delivered reliably?

 

[bbrez]

hwaite losing the direct Leeds services... not saying that isn't an inconvenience but Twitter does bring out the negatives doesn't it? Surely a more reliable service with a change is better than a direct train that never shows up while several identical trains whizz through with no sign of the promised stop orders being given... I do note that the TPE Twitter operative doesn't explain that this should make the service more reliable. Surely the first thing to do is explain why a change is being made?

TPE PR and Comms is generally very good, but they really need explain things in more detail in these kind of replies.

Still think it's silly that Mossley is not included in the stopper.

Edit: Even stranger, it's not even in TPE's media centre.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

TPE PR and Comms is generally very good, but they really need explain things in more detail in these kind of replies.

Still think it's silly that Mossley is not included in the stopper.

Edit: Even stranger, it's not even in TPE's media centre.

Mossley isn't included because it is served by the Hull semi-fast (and presumably still will be). West of Huddersfield the stopper is a semi-fast anyway, with the 4 stations between HUD and Stalybridge being shared between the Hull and Leeds services. It's only East of Huddersfield that there's a real difference between the Hull and the Leeds, with the former only calling at Dewsbury and Batley while the latter calls everywhere but Cottingley.

There was talk of the Hull service having some stops removed, if Batley is one of those I'll not be pleased!

 

[Andyh82]

Transpennine confirmed on their Twitter that the stopper will be split. Definitely the right decision.

https://twitter.com/TPEassist/status/1045214945103818752

I’m guessing the ‘5 years’ is people getting confused about the recent news story saying that there would be disruption for 5 years when they upgrade the line.

 

[DaiGog]

From December, the 1540 and 1640 HUL-MAN will continue to call at Slaithwaite according to what's in TRUST at the moment, but no HUL-MAN (or v.v.) will call at Batley. Slaithwaite is served by the hourly HUD-MAN stopper plus those two evening peak extra calls - in the morning peak there are two additional MAN-HUD stoppers operated by Northern which call at Slaithwaite, but no additional calls in any TPE services. Could change yet I suppose.

As things stand, the 0548 MIA-MBR/HUL splits at Leeds, but from December it becomes just a Middlesbrough service with the Hull portion starting at Leeds at 0717. That said, the current timetable started off with that arrangement (before it went live) but I assume diagramming dictated that the set for the LDS-HUL was to come off Ardwick, so again that may change.

 

[DaiGog]

Also the MAN-HUD stoppers are shown as TPE services, where previously I'd heard they were to be operated by Northern (not just the two additionals mentioned above).

 

[61653 HTAFC]

From December, the 1540 and 1640 HUL-MAN will continue to call at Slaithwaite according to what's in TRUST at the moment, but no HUL-MAN (or v.v.) will call at Batley. Slaithwaite is served by the hourly HUD-MAN stopper plus those two evening peak extra calls - in the morning peak there are two additional MAN-HUD stoppers operated by Northern which call at Slaithwaite, but no additional calls in any TPE services. Could change yet I suppose.

As things stand, the 0548 MIA-MBR/HUL splits at Leeds, but from December it becomes just a Middlesbrough service with the Hull portion starting at Leeds at 0717. That said, the current timetable started off with that arrangement but I assume diagramming dictated that the set for the LDS-HUL was to come off Ardwick, so again that may change.

If that's what transpires, both TPE management and WYITA (who could and should lobby harder for residents) can expect bagfuls of angry letters. Batley is being sold short again and our soap-star MP is ineffective at best.

 

[yorksrob]

The Marsden loop seems to be closed at the moment, which is making regulating trains a lot more difficult. Have been stuck behind a late stopper all the way to Stalybridge.