Staff attitude to PRIV Boxes and Dating them

[MattRobinson]

The 'it's an extra member of staff in an emergency' thing doesn't wash with me, tbh. Surely, the members of staff who're paid to be there should be able to deal with an situation and if there's not enough of them to do so, then there should be more working that train.

I work on a preserved railway, and would like to think that if the worst happened, I'd be able to offer some assistance. It's documented that other railway enthusiasts have done so in the past. Surely, by the argument above, that should mean that I get free rail travel?

However, I must point out that IMO, rail staff should get unlimited free travel as a perk.

Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk 2

 

[RJ]

The 'it's an extra member of staff in an emergency' thing doesn't wash with me, tbh. Surely, the members of staff who're paid to be there should be able to deal with an situation and if there's not enough of them to do so, then there should be more working that train.

I don't think it's quite appreciated on this forum that railway staff are individual human beings with their own personalitiy traits. They are not homogenous and certainly not unilateral with regards to the way they interact with passengers. Some are better equipped to deal with difficult situations than others. Staff vary in knowledge, physique, street wisdom, intelligence, ability to influence and build a rapport with their passengers and so on. Some need support to deal with certain difficult situations, whilst others don't.

When I had my Govia Staff Pass, I used to pass the time by travelling on HS1 quite often. One night, on the last train of the day, the conductor was struggling to handle a case which got on at Canterbury, intent on getting to London with no means to pay. The conductor announced at Ashford that he was calling the police and that the train wouldn't move until they arrived.

Seeing as I wasn't paying and had probably used up £000s worth of travel with that pass, I promptly decided to get involved. In less than a minute, I convinced the errant passenger to get off the train. I feigned resonance and sympathy with the foolhardy passenger, something which the conductor didn't have the ability or nous to do himself. I grew up in South London, going to a school which was a breeding ground for abrasive ghetto types and having to frequent the streets where they loitered. During this time, I learnt a thing or two about the way their minds work and as such, am equipped to deal with them in any situation, whilst fortunately not turning out like them. However, many staff who aren't street wise need to to delay trains and request police assistance, as they haven't a clue on how to communicate with such people. Not necessarily their fault, but all the same, it's naive to assume that all staff are able to deal with all situations equally well.

You could say that anyone could do what I did, but I walked 5 coaches through the train the instant that I heard that the conductor was having problems. I didn't see anyone else attempt to step in. It was a bit of a sad story with that passenger, he didn't care that the police were coming as he said that he already had a criminal record and had nothing to lose. However, I said a few things to him and before long, he was on his way.

Had a couple of other situations on HS1 where the conductor was grateful of my presence and role in solving problems they weren't handling well on their own. To me, it came as second nature to help out other railwaymen, even if I didn't work for that TOC.

 

[Matt Taylor]

The 'it's an extra member of staff in an emergency' thing doesn't wash with me, tbh. Surely, the members of staff who're paid to be there should be able to deal with an situation and if there's not enough of them to do so, then there should be more working that train.

May I politely suggest you read up on United flight 232 in 1989 and the actions off an off duty crew member named Denny Fitch. Also take a look at the report into the Ladbroke Grove rail accident and the actions of the off duty Virgin Cross Country conductor who was travelling on the train.

 

[yorkie]

The 'it's an extra member of staff in an emergency' thing doesn't wash with me, tbh. Surely, the members of staff who're paid to be there should be able to deal with an situation and if there's not enough of them to do so, then there should be more working that train.

Have you ever seen some of the rowdy crowds that join services to Sunderland, Middlesbrough and Newcastle at York station on a Friday or Saturday night?

Ah, thought not...

 

[Bill EWS]

A ticket snapper made a pathtic comment to me when travelling on the Matlock-Derby with a free pass and grumbled that I/we should only be allowed priv concessions. Obviously one who doesn't get much by way of concession in this privatised railway! Jelousie is a sad thing! It took me many years to get the concessions that I have. You had to do a fixed number of years before you got Euopean concessions and gained extra concessions by working up through the grade to driver, which in my case took me 11 years, some others many more than that.

I only use my passes for longer journies and for all others purchase priv rate. I think I use them quite wisely and don't wouldn't dream of misusing them. I haven't even tried getting extra travel out of them such as going to a train crew member I may know and expect to travel without dating a box and Never go onto a train without signing a box, either at home before leaving or at the station while waiting for a train. Doing so at the station is usually because I am having a long day out and there is a possibility that the chosen train may be running too late, or is cancelled, making that particular day out not worth the bother of going and therefore wasting a box.

Present day staff who grudge older and retired staff their concessions should hang their heaeds in shame. It isn't our fault you came on the railways later and in different circumstances. Likewise, if you are one of those all for privatisation and voted for the government of the day to carry that out, then you only got what you wanted, or voted for. Don't come onto Forums such as this and moan about it.

Under BR we worked together and for the country, not for some foreign company and their, most likely, foreign shareholders, who couldn't give a dam about others' working conditions.

 

[KA4C]

A ticket snapper made a pathtic comment to me when travelling on the Matlock-Derby with a free pass and grumbled that I/we should only be allowed priv concessions. Obviously one who doesn't get much by way of concession in this privatised railway! Jelousie is a sad thing! It took me many years to get the concessions that I have. You had to do a fixed number of years before you got Euopean concessions and gained extra concessions by working up through the grade to driver, which in my case took me 11 years, some others many more than that.

I only use my passes for longer journies and for all others purchase priv rate. I think I use them quite wisely and don't wouldn't dream of misusing them. I haven't even tried getting extra travel out of them such as going to a train crew member I may know and expect to travel without dating a box and Never go onto a train without signing a box, either at home before leaving or at the station while waiting for a train. Doing so at the station is usually because I am having a long day out and there is a possibility that the chosen train may be running too late, or is cancelled, making that particular day out not worth the bother of going and therefore wasting a box.

Present day staff who grudge older and retired staff their concessions should hang their heaeds in shame. It isn't our fault you came on the railways later and in different circumstances. Likewise, if you are one of those all for privatisation and voted for the government of the day to carry that out, then you only got what you wanted, or voted for. Don't come onto Forums such as this and moan about it.

Under BR we worked together and for the country, not for some foreign company and their, most likely, foreign shareholders, who couldn't give a dam about others' working conditions.

Excellent post, very well said.

Jealousy is very unattractive
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

May I politely suggest you read up on United flight 232 in 1989 and the actions off an off duty crew member named Denny Fitch.

Absolutely

 

[ANorthernGuard]

A ticket snapper made a pathtic comment to me when travelling on the Matlock-Derby with a free pass and grumbled that I/we should only be allowed priv concessions. Obviously one who doesn't get much by way of concession in this privatised railway! Jelousie is a sad thing! It took me many years to get the concessions that I have. You had to do a fixed number of years before you got Euopean concessions and gained extra concessions by working up through the grade to driver, which in my case took me 11 years, some others many more than that.

I only use my passes for longer journies and for all others purchase priv rate. I think I use them quite wisely and don't wouldn't dream of misusing them. I haven't even tried getting extra travel out of them such as going to a train crew member I may know and expect to travel without dating a box and Never go onto a train without signing a box, either at home before leaving or at the station while waiting for a train. Doing so at the station is usually because I am having a long day out and there is a possibility that the chosen train may be running too late, or is cancelled, making that particular day out not worth the bother of going and therefore wasting a box.

Present day staff who grudge older and retired staff their concessions should hang their heaeds in shame. It isn't our fault you came on the railways later and in different circumstances. Likewise, if you are one of those all for privatisation and voted for the government of the day to carry that out, then you only got what you wanted, or voted for. Don't come onto Forums such as this and moan about it.

Under BR we worked together and for the country, not for some foreign company and their, most likely, foreign shareholders, who couldn't give a dam about others' working conditions.

Well said, there are not that many staff who are jealous though. It seems to come from a minority of passengers and enthusiasts, most passengers are actually surprised we don't get free travel (officially) why there is such a grudge against traincrew getting free travel by a minority of people I will never understand. I don't know if its the jealousy of the perks of the jealousy of the fact 99 percent of us stick together. Either way it will never change how I and many others view things. However everyone has a right to their own opinion as long as its not used to bait other members as what happened on this thread a few pages ago.

 

[Solent&Wessex]

A ticket snapper made a pathtic comment to me when travelling on the Matlock-Derby with a free pass and grumbled that I/we should only be allowed priv concessions. Obviously one who doesn't get much by way of concession in this privatised railway! Jelousie is a sad thing! It took me many years to get the concessions that I have. You had to do a fixed number of years before you got Euopean concessions and gained extra concessions by working up through the grade to driver, which in my case took me 11 years, some others many more than that.

I only use my passes for longer journies and for all others purchase priv rate. I think I use them quite wisely and don't wouldn't dream of misusing them. I haven't even tried getting extra travel out of them such as going to a train crew member I may know and expect to travel without dating a box and Never go onto a train without signing a box, either at home before leaving or at the station while waiting for a train. Doing so at the station is usually because I am having a long day out and there is a possibility that the chosen train may be running too late, or is cancelled, making that particular day out not worth the bother of going and therefore wasting a box.

Present day staff who grudge older and retired staff their concessions should hang their heaeds in shame. It isn't our fault you came on the railways later and in different circumstances. Likewise, if you are one of those all for privatisation and voted for the government of the day to carry that out, then you only got what you wanted, or voted for. Don't come onto Forums such as this and moan about it.

Under BR we worked together and for the country, not for some foreign company and their, most likely, foreign shareholders, who couldn't give a dam about others' working conditions.

Well said, there are not that many staff who are jealous though. It seems to come from a minority of passengers and enthusiasts, most passengers are actually surprised we don't get free travel (officially) why there is such a grudge against traincrew getting free travel by a minority of people I will never understand. I don't know if its the jealousy of the perks of the jealousy of the fact 99 percent of us stick together. Either way it will never change how I and many others view things. However everyone has a right to their own opinion as long as its not used to bait other members as what happened on this thread a few pages ago.

To an extent I agree, jealousy isn't pleasant and there is no need for it. Those people (such as myself) starting post 1996 got into the job knowing what the concessions were, and understanding that as the owning company you work for changes, so do your concessions (i.e. employees of First Group TOCs get free travel on other First TOCs and heavily discounted bus tickets and can buy £5 flat fare train tickets for friends - but the TOC change from First to National Express ownership, that would change those concessions).

HOWEVER, I don't agree with the attitude that "I worked long and hard for my concessions and you are only jealous" attitude displayed by many protected and retired staff. I have worked 10 years in the industry, and depending on the what happens to the retirement age could do another 30 - 35 more before retiring. At that point, if things stay the same, I will walk away with absolutely diddly squat as a reward for such long service and hard work. Personally I don't care how much service you have, who you work(ed) for, or anything else - all I expect is for people to use the facilities they have been afforded in the correct manner and not take the p*ss. For those who have boxes it is only fair for those that don't.

I would agree too that there are not many staff who are actually jealous - many, such as myself, just want everyone to use their facilities correctly. I cannot just jump on a train and get free travel that I am not entitled to, so I don't expect anyone else to either - and I don't see why protected staff pass holders should expect to travel around for free for many more days than they are entitled to .

Sadly many people with boxes do not fill in a box, or buy a ticket, and get in a strop (some quite angrily) when it is suggested they need to do one or the other of those options. It is not the fact that they have those free facilities which annoys me, but the fact that so many of them seem to expect to get a lot more than they are entitled to - and then trot out the same old excuses (very similar to those quoted above) - as to why I shouldn't make them date a box or buy a ticket.

Use you free dates wisely, and buy a ticket like I have to the rest of the time - that is all I ask.

 

[the sniper]

I think there's a difference between being jealous and begrudging retired/ex-BR staff their privileges. I have to admit that I am a bit jealous (though jealously may be they wrong description ) of them and believe that the Unions should be perusing boxes for all ATOC staff and post retirement privileges, though sadly they don't seem interested. Does that mean I begrudge BR staff their privileges? Absolutely not! I don't personally know many Guards at my TOC who'd quibble over boxes being dated.

I'd also say that most believe in the idea that we're all just railwaymen (and women), no matter who's colour scheme is temporarily applied to the train. Some like to be asked by other TOCs employees before they board the train if they're looking for free travel, but few decline free travel full stop.

 

[Bill EWS]

It has nothing to do with working long or hard for these concessions, simply that the concessions that you get when you retire is what is due to you as at that time. The deal was made.

Likewise, remember too that wages under BR were quite low, compared to what you get under privatisation. Part of that wage increase meant that you were not going to get the same sort of deals anymore. Likewise, If a company suddenly pays you twice as much as before they are going to want a lot in return. In BR days you had a 'basic' 8 hour working day. Overtime was not compulsory and your depot only had the number of Sundays the type of work at the depot allowed. There was not much freight, in general, on a Sunday.

It was no surprise to me that when we started receiving double, or even more, wages that you suddenly found yourself working regular 12 hour shifts and almost every Sunday. As I say, they are not paying you double wages to be sitting at home! The loss of concessions and many of the perks you had under BR was paid for by higher wages. Now you appear to want to have it all! They bought you off.

They only had to deal with one company/department/office in BR days. Today there are too many individual companies, each looking after their own corner and are not interested in what other company staff get, only what they are prepared to pay for. Why should a freight only company pay for their staff to use other company's passenger trains. As long as privatisation exsits I can never see much changing.

The Union's hands are tied with the cutting of their powers. You are not likely to get one company to go on strike or threaten go-slows etc while the present anti-Union laws exisit. As said previously, if you wanted and voted for privatisation then you have simply got what you asked for.

 

[34D]

I work on a preserved railway, and would like to think that if the worst happened, I'd be able to offer some assistance. It's documented that other railway enthusiasts have done so in the past. Surely, by the argument above, that should mean that I get free rail travel?

Well no I'm sure you could offer some level of assistance in certain circumstances, however I'm sure you'll appreciate that preserved railway familiarity (even the more professional railways, who offer a PTS/TSC-esque course) has very little applicability to the 'big' railway. Which side do you evacuate from at a specific location? Which side is the third rail on? How does one contact control/the signaller? And many more things that I couldn't begin to understand.

Besides, preserved railways volunteers get a Heritage Railways pass to travel on other heritage railways for free!!

 

[9K43]

When I finished with the worlds worst FOC, I got 16 instances per year on my CARD for me and my wife.
These Travel concessions were not given to me cos they liked me, I got them as that was part of my employment rights.
If persons did not get free travel, well thats hard luck for you.
I also make sure I use every one of the passes, and I keep my old travel cards.
One of the problems we have, is that most guards will not take money from you, but we always pay for the rides we have, if we have not dated the travel card.
As for knowing the road, I can tell where I am by the line side smells, or the flick of the track suffering from dampness..
Not like the recent problems in the channel tunnel fire.

 

[BestWestern]

All rail staff are welcome on board my train, no charge for colleagues. I include the Network Rail boys in that definition, who in my view are every bit as much a part of the railway; no track, no trains. Yes it's all very unofficial, but it's something which many of us have no problem with and I would suggest that it's very unlikely to stop any time soon.

As with many of us out there at the sharp end, I cut my passengers a fair bit of slack on a daily basis. Railcard issues are usually excessed rather than me stinging people for the full price of a new ticket where I consider it to be appropriate (which is most of the time); people who ask politely if they can use their Advance an hour early are generally OK if the train isn't busy; I will carry a couple of extra cycles if I can do it safely and so on. In view of that, I have no issue with a staff member from a fellow TOC hitching a lift. I could instead do everything by the book, have increased grief every day and enjoy my job far less. But it's nice to spread a little goodwill where you can.

 

[richw]

Best western, in regards to your second paragraph I believe from my experiences you are in the majority. Don't know which TOC you are but your approach mentioned above sounds like many of my experiences with fgw staff. As a regular traveller from Cornwall to London fgw staff seem to go over and above the level of duty expected of them to assist customers wherever reasonably possible. The majority understand a genuine ticketing error and show discretion, just excessing the ticket, and explaining to the passenger the error they have made. Showing such discretion makes for a happier day for the passenger and staff member so makes a lot more sense to me, than going out to sting and punish passengers who make genuine errors.

 

[scotsman]

The 'it's an extra member of staff in an emergency' thing doesn't wash with me, tbh. Surely, the members of staff who're paid to be there should be able to deal with an situation and if there's not enough of them to do so, then there should be more working that train.

I work on a preserved railway, and would like to think that if the worst happened, I'd be able to offer some assistance. It's documented that other railway enthusiasts have done so in the past. Surely, by the argument above, that should mean that I get free rail travel?

As a heritage rail volunteer/railtour steward....I couldn't disagree more. They're paid for what they do, we aren't - why should we expect privileges from an industry we contribute nothing to?

 

[KA4C]

Well no I'm sure you could offer some level of assistance in certain circumstances, however I'm sure you'll appreciate that preserved railway familiarity (even the more professional railways, who offer a PTS/TSC-esque course) has very little applicability to the 'big' railway. Which side do you evacuate from at a specific location? Which side is the third rail on? How does one contact control/the signaller? And many more things that I couldn't begin to understand.

Quite, a little bit of knowledge can be a dangerous thing. There was a various serious operating incident recently that involved a heritage railway member of staff doing something that he shouldn't have done and wasn't qualified to do, out on the big railway

 

[158801]

Time for my input...

I joined the railway too late. Privatisation had taken place. Now I get free travel on my own TOC and a limited amount of free travel on the other companies that my TOC's parent group runs.

I'd love unlimited free travel but I wasn't on the railway in 1990 and I wasn't senior management.

I don't hold a grudge against those who were, those who do, those who have.

If I want to travel on XXX between A & B I know I have a choice. Buy a public rate Advance ticket, buy a PRIV ticket or ask the guard. Generally it's one of the former two options.

Only twice have I ever asked the guard for a free ride and that was because I was stranded, a long way from home with several hours to wait for a train that I could use free of charge.

I know that I'm making a journey in November. I've just purchased Advance tickets as my free travel allowance doesn't cover the journey I am making.

If I'm on that train and it derails or catches fire I will make myself known to the guard and offer assistance. This is something that I would do whether I had paid or not.

On my trains I get quite a few staff from other TOC's commuting into work - in uniform. They EXPECT a free ride. They NEVER ask. A member of the public making the same journey would pay £40 per week. These members of staff could do it for £10 ! WOW ! What a bargain - but they still expect it free.

What amazes, upsets and angers me is how much we talk about customer service. If we really put our customers first and gave them good service, then members of staff would wait on the platform until everyone else had boarded. We wouldn't expect a free first class upgrade - but be content to stand whilst the people who pay our wages get a seat.
We wouldn't be very happy in Tesco's if we saw that they had advertised steak at 10p per Kg. Then, when we walk in the shop, find that the staff are blatantly taking it all.
If a member of railway staff (who is not entitled to free travel on my train) rudely and arrogantly boards and expects a free journey - without asking me first - then I will gladly charge them (the priv rate - assuming they have their red ATOC priv card and not some company issued card). If they have happily got themselves a seat and other fare paying passengers are standing then I won't even give them a PRIV, but the full Anytime fare like I would a "normal" passenger.

It's like the "policeman" thing. People seem to let coppers travel free - just in case they are needed. I would like to think that a decent police person would help whether they had free travel or not.

In my humble opinion it's time all of rail staff accepted what they have - the good and the bad and stopped expecting and sometimes demanding things that we are not supposed to have. If you want to bend the rules, if you want something that you're not entitled to - like a free trip on another company or don't want to date a box then use some respect. Ask the guard and let the fare paying passengers of that TOC get a seat .

 

[Mr Spock]

One of the reasons for allowing all railway staff to travel free is so that they can offer help in an emergency.

It also appears that you do not want help from people who work on preserved railways because they are not experienced on the "big railway" but I am pretty sure that not all these big railway staff who are going to assist you have knowledge of how the operational railways work.

 

[KA4C]

It also appears that you do not want help from people who work on preserved railways because they are not experienced on the "big railway"

It is not a case of "want / not want", it is a case of competence isn't it, what roles would pres railway staff have the competence to carryout in an emergency situation?

Assist with train evac and little else, I would suggest. Most don't have the required training / ongoing assessments of competence required. The member of staff needing assistance needs to be sure that the person assisting has the knowledge to do so, they don't have time to check this out. Most would look for rail staff carrying a SCWID card

A well meaning amateur would simply get in the way

As I have already mentioned, we have already had very serious incident involving a pres railway member of staff doing something on the "big railway" that he was not qualified to do, that incident was a free lesson

 

[34D]

On my trains I get quite a few staff from other TOC's commuting into work - in uniform. They EXPECT a free ride. They NEVER ask. A member of the public making the same journey would pay £40 per week. These members of staff could do it for £10 ! WOW ! What a bargain - but they still expect it free.

Except of course there are various arrangements for duty travel that one would expect apply here. Considering what a 'reasonable' commute might be, are u saying there are two adjacent TOC who don't have a reciprocal arrangement?

It's like the "policeman" thing. People seem to let coppers travel free - just in case they are needed. I would like to think that a decent police person would help whether they had free travel or not.

But a number of current fares manuals enshrine this entitlement to writing. Not sure which TOC you are on, but knowing that 158801 is a former TransPennine unit, I can only suggest you read the staff guides to WY metro and GM tickets again, as it is in those documents.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

As I have already mentioned, we have already had very serious incident involving a pres railway member of staff doing something on the "big railway" that he was not qualified to do, that incident was a free lesson

Mind if I ask what happened here? Feel welcome to PM in confidence if you'd prefer.

 

[Mr Spock]

It is not a case of "want / not want", it is a case of competence isn't it, what roles would pres railway staff have the competence to carryout in an emergency situation?

Assist with train evac and little else, I would suggest. Most don't have the required training / ongoing assessments of competence required. The member of staff needing assistance needs to be sure that the person assisting has the knowledge to do so, they don't have time to check this out. Most would look for rail staff carrying a SCWID card

A well meaning amateur would simply get in the way

As I have already mentioned, we have already had very serious incident involving a pres railway member of staff doing something on the "big railway" that he was not qualified to do, that incident was a free lesson

Of course you would want staff with SCWID but do you check if they have this before offering free travel, of course not becuase as has been posted numerous times you offer free travel to ALL railway staff.

I am past caring if you want to offer free travel because that is your decision but the excuses you come up with are a bit weak.

Presumably if you are having trouble with a couple of passengers you will not want assistance from other passengers unless you know that they are trained in dealing with that type of situation.

I was on a train the other day when a passenger badly scalded themselves with a cup of coffee and although the staff gave some help (a coolpack I think) the passenger eventually had to be treated by a paramedic so does this mean you will offer free travel to medical staff in case someone gets hurt?

I could go on but I know that at the end of the day it is your decision about offering free travel and although I obviously do not agree with it I accept that.

 

[the sniper]

It's like the "policeman" thing. People seem to let coppers travel free - just in case they are needed. I would like to think that a decent police person would help whether they had free travel or not.

That's not official policy at your TOC? It is at mine, and I thought it was in most of them.

 

[GB]

Presumably if you are having trouble with a couple of passengers you will not want assistance from other passengers unless you know that they are trained in dealing with that type of situation.

Slightly different though isn't it? While it helps, you don't have to have training or a specific competence in that sort of situation or to back the guard up by just standing up and being a visible presence. Many people have this ability naturally or have learnt it as part of their day to day job.

 

[KA4C]

Of course you would want staff with SCWID but do you check if they have this before offering free travel, of course not becuase as has been posted numerous times you offer free travel to ALL railway staff.

I am past caring if you want to offer free travel because that is your decision but the excuses you come up with are a bit weak.

Presumably if you are having trouble with a couple of passengers you will not want assistance from other passengers unless you know that they are trained in dealing with that type of situation.

I was on a train the other day when a passenger badly scalded themselves with a cup of coffee and although the staff gave some help (a coolpack I think) the passenger eventually had to be treated by a paramedic so does this mean you will offer free travel to medical staff in case someone gets hurt?

I could go on but I know that at the end of the day it is your decision about offering free travel and although I obviously do not agree with it I accept that.

Please demonstrate where I have said that I offer free travel to rail staff (I do not work in a role where I can do that) or where I have said that I expect free travel (I don't and personally, I have never tried to bunk first either) do please do get your facts right

 

[175001]

All rail staff are welcome on board my train, no charge for colleagues. I include the Network Rail boys in that definition, who in my view are every bit as much a part of the railway; no track, no trains. Yes it's all very unofficial, but it's something which many of us have no problem with and I would suggest that it's very unlikely to stop any time soon.

As with many of us out there at the sharp end, I cut my passengers a fair bit of slack on a daily basis. Railcard issues are usually excessed rather than me stinging people for the full price of a new ticket where I consider it to be appropriate (which is most of the time); people who ask politely if they can use their Advance an hour early are generally OK if the train isn't busy; I will carry a couple of extra cycles if I can do it safely and so on. In view of that, I have no issue with a staff member from a fellow TOC hitching a lift. I could instead do everything by the book, have increased grief every day and enjoy my job far less. But it's nice to spread a little goodwill where you can.

Exactly my attitude on the job.

In the messrooms, you hear the ones who moan about all the grief they get but that's due to the fact they bring it on to themselves.

 

[trc666]

Our TOC's official policy regarding police travel is that the Metropolitan, City of London and British Transport Police are allowed to travel on production of their warrant card. A Police Officer Rail Card (or White Card as we call it) is also required to be shown in the case of the Met. Police Staff, Special Constables and Traffic Wardens do not get free travel. City of London Police Officers that have 'NOT VALID FOR ATOC TRAVEL' printed on their warrant cards do not get free travel.

 

[158801]

But a number of current fares manuals enshrine this entitlement to writing. Not sure which TOC you are on, but knowing that 158801 is a former TransPennine unit, I can only suggest you read the staff guides to WY metro and GM tickets again, as it is in those documents.

How do you get hold of these - never heard of them ?

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Exactly my attitude on the job.

In the messrooms, you hear the ones who moan about all the grief they get but that's due to the fact they bring it on to themselves.

That is so True, and they just don't get why they get abuse/assaulted etc (which is obviously still totally unacceptable) but its always the same ones and probably always will be, to some people the rules override common sense and decency.

 

[richw]

That is so True, and they just don't get why they get abuse/assaulted etc (which is obviously still totally unacceptable) but its always the same ones and probably always will be, to some people the rules override common sense and decency.

Its the same in any customer facing role, not just the railways, its always the same few employees that have problems. Possibly bad luck, but i'd put my money on being the employees attitude or approach to the customer, that causes more hassle than its worth.

 

[MattRobinson]

The preserved railway thing was somewhat of a red herring, my point was that the argument 'An off duty member of staff would be able to help if something went wrong' is poor. As I said before, the staff on the train should be able to deal with any situation that arises (and if there's not enough of them, that raises serious concerns...). No, rail staff aren't automatons, but there's deemed enough of them on a train for it to be deemed safe, so they shouldn't need extra staff.

But to answer some of the arguments, I don't think that I (in my capacity of volunteer on a preserved railway) should be entitled to free travel, and I don't think that the argument should be applied to off duty rail staff (although as I stated before, that's no reason that it shouldn't be a perk of the job).

With regards to what I could do in an emergency, I agree, not a lot. But I could probably do something to help, especially if a member of the train crew had been injured or killed. Helping evacuate a train was mentioned higher up the thread, but TBH I'd just help in any way I could (even just keeping people calm on board the train while waiting for help to arrive).

Mind if I ask what happened here? Feel welcome to PM in confidence if you'd prefer.

I'd also like to know please.